Open Thread, September 30 - October 6, 2013

Scott Garrabrant

If it's worth saying, but not worth its own post (even in Discussion), then it goes here.

I need some advice. I recently moved to a city and I don't know how to stop myself from giving money to strangers! I consider this charity to be questionable and, at the very least, inefficient. But when someone gets my attention and asks me specifically for a certain amount of money and tells me about themselves, I won't refuse. I don't even feel annoyed that it happened, but I do want to have it not happen again. What can I do?

The obvious precommitment to make is to never carry cash. I am strongly considering this and could probably do so, but it is nice to be able to have at least enough for a bus trip, a quick lunch or for some emergency. I have tried to give myself a running tally of number of people refused and when that gets to, say, 20, I would donate something to a known legitimate charity. While doing so makes me feel better about passing beggars by, it doesn't help once someone gets me one-on-one. So I've never gotten to that tally without resetting it first by succumbing to someone. Is there some way to not look like an easy mark? Are there any good standard pieces of advice and resources for this?

However, I always find these exchanges to be really fascinating from the point of view of the Dark Arts used. The most recent time this happened, I was stopped and asked for the time which he promptly ignored. Then he told me that he had seen me around before - this is entirely plausible since I walk by there most days but is also likely to be true of a randomly selected person so could just be a shot in the dark. He shook my hand multiple times. Gave me his name and told me to call him by his nickname. He told me about being a veteran, talked to me about any veterans I knew. Tried to guess my current job and messed up in a way that implied I was younger than I am which was probably his only significant mistake as that could have annoyed some people. He then acted impressed when I corrected him. Asked where I was from and then said he had an acquaintance from nearby. Then of course he asked for train ride money which started at 8 dollars and ended up being 23.

I could practically check off the chapters of Cialdini's Influence one-by-one on this list and noticed at least two of these tactics while they were being used. Unfortunately, Cialdini's book has laughable excuses for sections on "Defense Against" said dark arts, rarely saying anything more than "just use the fact that they're using these tricks against them since now you know better!" So, here I am, knowing the nature of my foe and yet still being utterly dragged in by it.

Let me suggest a world view which is much less negative than the other replies: I view panhandlers as vendors of warm fuzzies and therefore treat them as I would any other street vendor whose product I am most likely not interested in. In particular, I have no reason to be hostile to them, or to be disrespectful of their trade.

If they engage me politely, I smile and say "No thanks." I think the second word there is helpful to my mindset and also makes their day a little better. If they become hostile or unpleasant, I feel no guilt about ignoring ... (read more)

8JoshuaFox13y

I was cured after I naively gave money to a street beggar, and was pursued for more money, to the point that I felt threatened. My usual procedure in the US is to actively pretend that beggars, and those who look like them, don't exist. Phil Collins wouldn't like it, but after that occasion and one or two like it, I feel scared. I truly admire a certain friend who can chit-chat on a friendly basis with a street person. As I got older and more confident, I developed other practices: 1. Someone asked for money for food, so I handed her a bag of fancy chocolate almonds I had in my hand. She looked like that wasn't what she was expecting. 2. In a friendly way, I told a collector for some ineffective charity that, in honor of his request, I would give 100 NIS more than usual to my regular charity, but not his. Chutzpah. 3. When a collector for some ineffective charity comes up to me, I solicit him, in a friendly way, to give money to my favorite charity before he has a chance to ask. Once I got 1 NIS this way, so I felt obliged to give him a (different) shekel. I then had fun ceremonially taking that 1 NIS coin to the treasurer, along with my usual donation. 4. Once I asked a phone collector for some ineffective charity, in a friendly way, to decide on my behalf: Should I give 100 NIS to a certain truly worthy cause, or deny it to that worthy cause and give it to her charity. She got quite tangled up trying to answer. In short, I became a little obnoxious. The fact that I regularly give a good amount to charity is probably what gave me the psychological leeway to do this. (And I wouldn't do any of that to a more-or-less worthy charity, or if a friend asked.)

9A1987dM13y

And yet people here are still surprised that gatekeepers could lose at the AI box game.