You might be amused to know that, in a different forum where I shared my essay, someone suggested that I try DMT. I demurred, with force, and said that if extraplanar entities showed up and started lecturing me on "universal love", I'd pull out a baseball bat. That Green Bat won't know what hit him.
(Incidentally, I don't exactly mean "take that, you big green bat" with 100% positive implications, FWIW I am not particularly resistant to the idea of universal love or similar thoughts provided they are set up in a way that is compatible with our understanding of the mechanics of reality. I also haven't taken any psychedelics in my life, so at least I did not receive these ideas by force majeure.)
I am not opposed to universal love in principle, but the universe is, from my perspective, not worthy of love. Most of it is empty vacuum and barren matter. That might very well change in the future.
I am reasonably fond of the average human, but hey, that's not a particularly uncommon stance to hold. I think the usual implication of "universal love" is that it should be a stronger belief than thinking "most people are alright, most of the time".
I'm not really even pointing directly at the object level thing of "feeling love for everyone/the universe", I'm thinking about something a bit more meta. It's something like "I hold the problem of induction in high regard, and I place a lot of probability mass on the idea that I have not explored the space of hypotheses sufficiently well. I think that somewhere out there there is a frame that fits the universe/everyone past and present with high accuracy which also showcases the good qualities that were always present in the universe/everyone past and present". I saw this Kirkegaard quote once about someone who is exactly like a police detective, but instead of trying to find guilt or crimes he tries his hardest to find love in everyone and everything, and I guess it's related to that.
Hmm. I will mull over that. But even if such a frame were to exist (it probably does, because there are an infinite number of hypotheses that fit any set of observations), I doubt I would want to subscribe to it without good reason. For example, let's say there was a tiger trying to eat me, or a man trying to murder me for my wallet. I would understand their hunger, their desperation, but I do not see myself loving them or wanting to love them. I understand this is a personal topic, and probably one that boils down to fundamental values too, in a manner not easily changed by rational argumentation for either of us.
Oh yeah, the competitive frame is dominant when you might die/are trapped in a zero sum struggle (for various reasons). But there is also a reason to take a love/cooperative frame, such as when you are embarking on a collaborative venture. And the chance to switch the frames of others offers a chance for effectively giving moloch a bloody nose (which, given your opinions on dmt entities, you might be in favour of).
Fair. I will note that you do not need to "love" another entity to engage in positive sum/pro-social trade (from a game theoretical perspective), but I suppose that affection and empathy makes it easier. At least oils the gears a bit.
I feel like this could be very short and titled something like stick to the plan, don't make decisions while high, and substances add if not multiply effects. I stopped reading when you puffed that joint because what would you expect from there?
I want to note that you did not perform the experiment you set out to. Acid in a normal dose might help your depression. Acid plus weed in normal doses of each would be a whole different beast.
Drawing conclusions about acid in normal or even slightly higher (a tab and a half isn't heroic) from this experience is entirely unjustified.
I have no idea if acid would help depression, I haven't reviewed the evidence. This is just a methodological note.
In my defense, I specifically noted that the methodology was garbage. If you compare and contrast with the essay I wrote about my experience with the psilocybin trial, I was far more meticulous (or at least the actual doctors and scientists running the trial were, and I was piggybacking on their hard work).
The main reason for sharing is not to endorse LSD as a treatment for TRD. I've noted that the evidence is far more robust in favor of ketamine or psilocybin, though the trials for the latter are still ongoing.
Why did I share, then?
In other words, not every post on a rationalist forum has to be advice on the right thing to do (though I do try and tell people the right thing to do). Noting the mistakes someone has made, or even the mistakes they almost made is often even more helpful for third parties.
And I am not sure why you think that somewhere around 400 ug (nominal, street estimate) of LSD is not a heroic dose. Even if my suspicion that it was weaker than advertised are correct, I think that the knowledge that a lower dose and even a modest amount of THC can produce extreme and potent synergistic effects was new to me, and probably to a lot of people. If you knew better and wouldn't have done this in the first place, good for you. I didn't. I want to share my experience. You are, of course, entitled to think that this information is of minimal value to you. I acknowledge that you have the right to say so.
Sorry to sound mean about it! I didn't really mean you shouldn't have shared, just that the most important part should've been up front and emphasized, like in the title.
I think that the knowledge that a lower dose and even a modest amount of THC can produce extreme and potent synergistic effects was new to me, and probably to a lot of people
That's why I was suggesting that should've been the headline. Expecting people to read a long (and entertaining!) post in case there's a nuggest of wisdom in there isn't realistic; there's too much good stuff on LW let alone in total.
I was objecting to your drawing conclusions against LSD from this experiment. Maybe your conclusion wasn't about LSD but about heavy psychedelics in general. That's more reasonable, but it's a stretch to think you'd get the same results from other psychedelics. The weed will have had strong and distinct effects that could block the effects of acid. Even a couple of puffs of modern weed is a pretty heavy dose if you're not a regular smoker (it seems like tolerance effects of weed are extreme, and weed is of course bred, grown, and sold by enthusiasts; those of us who smoke rarely would pay more for weaker weed that wouldn't make us way too high by accident).
I read some of the remainder, and it's great. I always enjoy your writing and get insight from it. Sorry to sound like I was saying you shouldn't have bothered.
It's really weird that people become convinced that god exists from psychedelic trips, when what it should tell you is wow yeah my mind is clearly a product of my brain function.
I think people just don't understand how good the human brain is at hallucinating. It's kind of a hallucination machine that's ordinarily guided by sensory experience. But both perception and imagination/simulation are improved by making it good at extrapolating/hallucinating.
Edit: now I see that the weed mistake wasn't the main point, and "God can send an email" is a great title. So I'd settle for the weed mistake in a TLDR.
>Sorry to sound mean about it! I didn't really mean you shouldn't have shared, just that the most important part should've been up front and emphasized, like in the title.
That's a reasonable take. I think it is valuable to find out why doing something is bad for you, and that's why I put effort into making the trip report entertaining (and hopefully educational). If someone told me that "don't mix THC with a large dose of LSD because of highly variable and unpredictable interactions when CB1 and 5HT2A receptors are strongly stimulated", it would be valuable advice, but not as valuable as a vivid example of how it went wrong.
I do disagree more strongly with:
>Expecting people to read a long (and entertaining!) post in case there's a nuggest of wisdom in there isn't realistic; there's too much good stuff on LW let alone in total.
After all, people share rationalist fiction here too. I can't see Scott or other writers putting up a "TLDR: This is the intended takeaway of the story" at the top. Sometimes you do need to read to the end to understand a piece, sometimes the compression, while possible, is lossy.
I don't think this essay would be improved with a submission statement saying:
"LSD is a somewhat interesting but not optimal treatment for TRD. Do not mix THC with a nominally high dose of LSD. You might experience ego-death, and I did, but pulled through."
It would not capture the intended intensity. I have a generally high opinion of the patience and intelligence of readers here (not claiming you think otherwise), and I write to both entertain and inform. If this was merely a trip-report, I wouldn't have considered sharing it here. I think that the fact that I'm an archetypal rat, reasonably well-informed about what I was doing (from a medical perspective, though probably not an exceptionally experienced psychonaut), and faced genuine challenge to the integrity of my ego/ontology - but came out intact to warn others - that all adds up.
>You did seem to come down against acid in there near the end, and that's just not justified by the experiment
I think you're drawing too broad a conclusion here. I'm not against LSD. It's a remarkably safe substance, with a better profile than many things I might prescribe in clinic. What I am cautioning against is taking very large doses, or combining it with THC. My understanding is that while the THC did potentiate the strong dose I personally took, nothing I experienced is out of the question for "just" heroic doses of THC. Do correct me if I'm wrong about that.
And that amounts to caveat emptor, not a general injunction to never try the stuff. Just to take even more care about how to do it, more than I did, despite me thinking I did my due diligence.
Another way to put it is that if I had read such a report myself, I'd have been far more cautious. I think I am close enough to the modal LW reader that the validity of the advice transfers. If your first reaction was to groan and shake your head when you read that I introduced THC into the mix, then you don't need my advice, and that is a good thing.
There is a version of this essay that I am contemplating writing, which explores the psychopharmacology in more detail (just like the psilocybin one). But I haven't written it, and might not. It will probably be heavier on nuance, or less nuanced in favor of more general and more specific disclaimers, depending on what's better for a more general audience. But I target other rats by default, and I think they don't need me to spell out everything.
Alternate title: Acid Convinced Me I Am Exactly Who I Thought I Was
As the engaged and parasocially addicted reader I hope you are, you might remember that I’ve previously dabbled in mind-altering substances. If not, context you should have is that I'm a psychiatry resident who suffers from ADHD and a rather stubborn case of treatment resistant depression. Up until recently, however, my exposure to anything serious was strictly limited to psilocybin administered under clinical conditions.
I originally accepted the mushroom extract because I was depressed. It worked, in the sense that I spent the next four months and change feeling reliably not depressed. Psychiatry loves to invent tidy Greek and Latin wrappers for the chaotic human experience, and “euthymic” is the designated term here. It is a polite way of describing the baseline state the rest of us are desperately trying to claw our way back to. At the very least, it’s what I write down in my clinical notes unless you, the patient, are giving me serious cause for concern.
But the psilocybin eventually wore off, and the medical establishment won't just put you back in a clinical trial because you ask nicely. I was struggling badly again, so I turned to LSD.
My first foray was a trial run. The dealer advertised a 300 µg tab, which I conservatively cut in half. Going by subjective effect, along with the generally optimistic nature of street mathematics, it felt closer to 75-125 µg. There were no real visuals. The walls maintained their structural integrity, abstaining from the perceptible motion usually reserved for earthquakes or skyscrapers. I felt wired, more thoughtful, but mostly just myself.
Also, I was nauseous as all hell. This is to be expected from a chemical structurally adjacent to those that mushrooms evolved to keep annoying animals at bay. Unfortunately, much like with capsaicin, humans have proven to be deeply paradoxical creatures, eagerly seeking out the exact substances that burn their throats and make their stomachs churn.
Subjectively, that low-ish dose felt like a middle sibling between the sheer euphoria of MDMA and the hyper-focused disengagement of psilocybin. The only real downside was some manageable next-day dysphoria. Still, I was dissatisfied with the intensity. There was no immediate relief from the grey fog. I eyed the remaining half-tab, took extensive notes, and decided I was ready to do it again. And harder.
I did, and I almost regret it.
Set and Setting
A few days prior, I had received what could only be described as objectively good news. Not perfect news, but I felt a few British stone, or one Indian boulder, lighter. I genuinely felt eager to face the near future. Unlike my clinical trial, where the goal was to banish a treatment-resistant depression that had plagued me for a decade, this time I just wanted to make the happiness stick. If that didn't work, I'd settle for lasting contentment.
I’d learned my lessons from the trial run. I kept ondansetron on hand, a rationalist’s best friend for serotonin-receptor-induced nausea. I cleared my schedule. I found a quiet room, cranked up the aircon, turned down the lights, and queued up a good sound system. I took a full "300 µg" tab, expecting a real-world 200, and swallowed the anti-nausea medication alongside it. My two dogs, creatures of gentle breeding and absolute loyalty, snuggled in without complaint.
The effects arrived on schedule. The ondansetron performed a miracle, muting the jaw-tingling and ear-stuffiness associated with extreme serotonergic stimulation. The music sounded expansive; the colors popped. Two hours in, I decided I liked the trajectory enough to swallow the remnants of the first tab.
Then my friends arrived.
They were good friends, old friends, some I hadn’t seen in years. They knew about my situation, though they mostly weren’t psychonauts themselves. The most experienced among them had once trip-sat a guy who ended up defecating in a sink, an indignity I fully intended to spare them. I just wanted temporary companions, not babysitters. We’re getting older; we have jobs, wives, and kids. I also had family a phone call away, though I was resolved to only break that glass in an absolute emergency.
We laughed and caught up. The man I call my best friend dragged me out to look at nature, or at least the best shrubbery my suburban garden had to offer. It was a hot, sunny day. The leaves were very green. I was... whelmed. Very pretty leaves, sure, but ultimately just plant organs devoted to reasonably efficient photosynthesis.
Then, one of my friends surprised us by producing a joint of unusually high-quality weed. I dimly recalled reading that THC enhances the effects of psychedelics. I took a few measured puffs. I thought I was being sensible.
I was very wrong. Oh god. Oh fuck.
Before the marijuana, I had noticed a remarkably large pimple on my best friend’s forehead, but I hadn’t commented on it, because we’re men and it’s not my place to critique his skincare routine. I remember thinking it was remarkably large, but hey, it's his face and his business. Shortly after the marijuana, I looked at another buddy and noted that he had clearly been skipping leg day. His torso was swole; his legs were stick-thin. Taken aback, he explained he hadn’t been to the gym in years. I checked on my best friend, and found that the pimple was present, but not nearly as obtrusive. I squinted, recalibrated, and finally realized that visual proportions were simply no longer a metric my brain had a good handle on.
My friends looked alien. I knew this was an illusion, in the same way I knew my two dogs, currently busy barking at and humping each other, were not actual wolves. But the visuals and the noise were provoking a rising tide of anxiety.
I politely told them I needed to lie down. They didn't mind and kept chatting. Eventually, even the sound of their voices became too intrusive, and I had to ask them to leave.
I was alone, and I knew the weed had shifted gears. The subtle color-shimmering behind my eyelids had mutated into aggressive fractals. The walls swayed. My phone, my lifeline for timestamped notes, was folding and warping in a manner explicitly not covered by the manufacturer's warranty.
I knew I was fucked. I laid back and strapped in.
The Peak
I just kept falling. My body became leaden while my mind buzzed like a hive. The music transitioned from enjoyable into a tidal wave of synesthesia-adjacent masterpieces.
And then, I stopped thinking in words.
For the relentlessly analytical creature that I am, this is an unusual experience. The time-stamped notes ceased. Time itself meant very little. I felt my sense of self begin to fray at the edges, and I felt the universe, God, the Singularity, the collective oneness of all existence, attempting to force its way into my mind. I remember thinking, in totally alien non-words, that perhaps belief in a higher power wasn't so bad after all.
This seductive impulse didn’t whisper. It didn’t knock. It kicked down the door while I was on the shitter.
A part of me recoiled. The core of my identity rebelled. It is not a metaphor when I say I saw literal tendrils, soft white shoots, forcing their way into the cracks of my mind, offering me metaphysical solace and cosmic meaning. It is even less of a metaphor when I say that the little kernel of "me" that remained manifested a pair of scissors and snipped them away as fast as they sprouted. Buddy, I saw these things. Knowing you're hallucinating is not a robust cure for insanity.
Next, I saw myself as a knot, pulled taut and threatening to unravel under the tension of competing ontologies and bad epistemics. But it held firm. Even a heroic dose of mind-altering substances failed to break my stubborn, logically oriented materialism. Before the peak, I had written in my notes that any version of me returning from this trip with claims of metaphysical insight was, in a very real sense, no longer me. Now I had peaked, and my priors remained perfectly intact.
I saw God trying to fuck my brain through my eye socket, and my first instinct was to castrate him. Okay, this one is an actual metaphor, but it's one I came up with barely after the peak.
I realized then that there is an immutable, unshakable core beneath the masks I wear. Short of serious neurological degradation, I could trust myself to persevere through whatever slings and arrows life throws at me without losing my mind.
The Descent and the Meta-Self
Eventually, time began to make sense again. I became introspective. I felt sobriety slowly reconstructing itself from the wreckage of my mind, though it was a drawn-out process.
The peak was followed by a gentle, strange glide. I remember one version of me during the comedown who despaired of ever reaching sobriety, terrified of annihilation, begging not to die, terrified that his specific qualia would vanish into compressed digital journal notes and fading, imperfect memory.
The next iteration of me was highly meta, a journalist preoccupied with the act of journalism. He finally understood (in emotive terms, and not just intellectually as I usually do) that the entity I call “myself” is a gestalt, a series of 3D snapshots embedded in a hypercube stretching from the past to the infinite future. My life is a relay race, each past self rushing to pass the baton to the next. At times, this was a brisk walk, at other times, a sprint. During the trip, the poor bastards that are myself were rolling downhill in wheelchairs. But hey, they did their job. Now I do mine. The internal continuity I feel might lack objective grounding, but it’s a load-bearing construct nonetheless.
This meta-self chuckled at how pretentious I would find him once sober. He knew he’d be gone soon, and he wished me well. He observed that a mind without the filters and structures we rely on is fundamentally non-functional. Sanity is adaptive. He faded away with a smile, handing the wheel back to the next, slightly more sober guy. For what it's worth, I don't dislike him as much as he thought. I recognize that aspect of myself, and am mostly fond of it.
At some point, I remembered Scott Alexander’s short story Samsara. It is the one about the solitary materialist in a world where everyone else has succumbed to an Enlightenment memetic plague that genuinely makes them happier at the cost of their epistemics. I identified with and felt great empathy for the protagonist, but I also looked down on him. I had just seen the face of God and spat at it. I was perfectly content remaining in the cycles of Samsara, even if the upholstery needs some work.
My live notes from this exact moment read:
Make of that what you will. I stand by it.
The Empty Quarry
The rest of the trip was an exercise in logistics and emotional housekeeping. I began to think and plan ahead, and regained opinions on the music, which gradually became less sublime. Along the way, I asked myself the questions I am usually afraid to answer out loud.
I noted my anxiety about the Singularity, which I believe is imminent on empirical grounds rather than faith. I fear death, and aging: for myself and those I love. I fear not being around to experience the end of the beginning. I want us to build heaven from the bones of an apathetic universe and forge something that cares out of dying stars. I genuinely think that is more likely than getting paperclipped, though not by a margin wide enough to bring me much peace.
I examined my anxieties about my career, my finances, and the lofty standards set by my parents. That I may or may not have the time to establish myself as a man, a husband and father, a writer, a doctor, before it becomes moot. I mused on how conflicted I feel about the trajectory of my life, even if I've usually lived up to my expectations and made my parents proud. I know I am not a bad person: I don't give my spare change away to save shrimp, but I do genuinely try to help. This was helpful to remember and also sincerely believe with most of my guard down.
I thought about my father, a surgeon who works harder than a human body should allow. He is not emotionally constipated; he cares deeply about my feelings. But quiet, relentless work is his love language. With tears drenching my cheeks, I realized he would work himself to death for us if he had to, and he’d die on his feet with a smile.
I don't want him to. I want to become so established that he can look at me, feel the safety of it, and finally slow down. At the same time, I notice I’ve inherited his drive. I work harder than I need to because I am already providing for the family I don't quite have yet: the wife yet unmarried, the kids yet unborn.
To my slight but enduring disappointment, it turns out my constant sober rumination and relentless introspection actually works. I already knew all of these answers. I could have produced them on minimal prodding when sober, even more easily if drunk and disinhibited. I have already done so, repeatedly.
Not even a heroic dose of LSD could help me mine for psychological insights that didn't exist; the quarry was already bare. I understand myself. I wouldn't trust any grand unified theories about the wider universe generated on acid, but I would have appreciated a slightly deeper glimpse into my own interiority. Like any good Bayesian, I am forced to treat this absence of evidence as evidence of absence. I am, almost certainly, exactly who I thought I was.
I wouldn’t ever like to be quite that high again. It felt dangerously close to bumping up against a glass ceiling of the psyche. I do intend to alter myself, physically and mentally, in the future, but psychedelics can only get you so far.
It is too early to tell if the contentment will stick, but the day after, I feel euthymic. It is quieter in my head. For someone with ADHD, this is a profound relief. As a delightful bonus, my usually omnipresent mild tinnitus seems to have vanished. If that proves permanent, the ordeal was worth it on those grounds alone.
I consider myself a better materialist for the experience. But note that I do not view the experience as self-flagellation, I didn't seek out... whatever the hell that was. The flagella of cosmic unity tried to force their way in, and I stayed the course. Can't let the team down; the ancestors and descendants are counting on me. If God or the administrators of the Ancestor Simulation want to talk to me that badly, they can send an email.
A Brief Note on Harm Reduction:
As clinical experiments go, my methodology was garbage. The clinician and the subject were the same person, and both of them were tripping balls in a manner they hadn’t realized was physically possible. I was already happier than I had been in a... very long time when I tried this. Nothing I have said or will say constitutes medical advice.
Do not take heroic doses of LSD unless you have a damn good reason. If you must, do not add cannabis unless you have meticulously researched the interactions. And if you do add cannabis, do not come crying to me when you find yourself castrating God with imaginary scissors to prevent Him from mind-fucking you. Or if you do get mind-fucked, for the matter, I will be sympathetic but less than useful. I've warned you. And I warn you again:
Some doors, once opened, cannot be closed until the half-life clears your system. Sometimes they stay ajar forever, no matter how hard you shove. From a mental health perspective, the evidence for psilocybin and ketamine is far more robust, and the latter is actually medically available in many jurisdictions.
I don't want to be this high ever again. But I am very glad to be back.