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dmac_93's Shortform

by dmac_93
28th Jun 2025
1 min read
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This is a special post for quick takes by dmac_93. Only they can create top-level comments. Comments here also appear on the Quick Takes page and All Posts page.
dmac_93's Shortform
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4Shankar Sivarajan
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4J Bostock
1CstineSublime
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[-]dmac_933mo30

While playing with evolutionary algorithms, I had the startling realization that all genetic mutations are bad. It’s common knowledge that biology abhors genetic mutation, and I assumed that was only because mutations cause cancer. But my computer programs are immune to cancer, and they also abhor mutations. This is counterintuitive, given that evolution requires mutations to procede.

For proof of the fact that mutations are bad, consider that evolution is an optimization algorithm, and after it reaches a local optimum further mutations will be strictly detrimental. The concept of evolutionary pressure is the ability of an evolutionary algorithm to remove deleterious mutations from a population. If mutations accumulate faster than they can be removed then the population will suffer a genetic collapse. This is a common failure mode of evolutionary algorithms.

The ideal evolutionary algorithm would have at most one mutation in each individual, and each of their lives would be an experiment to evaluate that single mutation. And then through many generations of chromosomal crossover the best mutations would combine into a single genome.

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[-]Shankar Sivarajan3mo42

all genetic mutations are bad.

You might be rediscovering Fisher's geometric model. A refinement to your current model you could consider is that close to, but not exactly at, the local optima, sufficiently small mutations have a 50% chance of being beneficial. 

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[-]dmac_933mo10

Thank you

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[-]dmac_933mo00

These two facts seem incompatible:

  1. Personalities are inherited. Identical twins separated at birth are statistically more similar than fraternal twins.
  2. The human population has almost zero genetic variation, and there is significant mixing so variations do not systematically cluster. Therefore, it seems unlikely that subtle personality differences are due to genetic variation.

My hypothesis is that animal personalities are encoded in epigenetic changes.

This allows personalities to be inherited, crossover, and evolve. Life experiences can induce epigenetic changes, which allows animals to reliably adapt in a single generation. All of this without requiring any genetic variation. A population of clones could have diverse personalities stored in their epigenome.

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[-]J Bostock3mo710

No need to invoke epigenetics, the answer is that 2 is false. Who is claiming 2 to be the case?

Humans clearly have large genetic variation in physical traits, why would mental traits be an exception?

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[-]dmac_933mo10

I think a better argument than #2 would be that evolution tends to remove genetic variantions.

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[-]J Bostock3mo40

This is also just not really true. Natural Selection (as opposed to genetic drift) can maintain genetic variations especially for things like personality, due to the fact that "optimal" behavioural strategies depend on what others are doing. Any monoculture of behavioural strategies is typically vulnerable to invasion by a different strategy. The equilibrium position is therefore mixed. It's more common for this to occur due to genetic variation than due to each individual using a mixed strategy.

Furthermore, humans have undergone rapid environmental change in recent history, which will have selected for lots of different behavioural traits at different times. So we're not even at equilibrium.

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[-]CstineSublime3mo10

Personalities are inherited. Identical twins separated at birth are statistically more similar than fraternal twins.

 

This is unclear: are you saying that identical twins separate at birth are more similar than fraternal twins who are raised together (therefore suggesting nature > nurture)? Or that identical twins separated form each other at birth are more similar to each other than fraternal twins separated form each other than birth? (Only suggesting that nature > uhhh less samey nature).

I would also really like to read the abstracts of all the papers that you're alluding to here because they sound like some quite fantastic claims.

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[-]dmac_933mo10

Compare like-to-like: separated identical twins to sepaparted fraternal twins.

I think the best introduction to the topic would be this lecture, which is mostly about all of the problems with separated twin studies. Identical twins starts at 37 minutes.

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[-]CstineSublime3mo20

Weird Synchronicity. I literally started reading "Why Don't Zebras Get Ulcers" last week.

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