OpenAI recently shared that they would start to use monitors for all RL training, "starting with activation classifiers ... that run at every sampled token" as well as "tool actions, available reasoning, and the full sequence of activity." This seems in tension with their stance on preserving monitorability.
The original paper on obfuscation is not especially opinionated, stating that "[w]hile it is likely these and other subtle pressures may impact CoT monitorability less than something like training against a CoT monitor, their effect should be further investigated."
Similarly, the New and Fragile Opportunity paper states clearly that "using CoT monitoring to identify and patch reward hacking vulnerabilities in training environments might put evolutionary pressure on CoT across multiple training runs."
Directly monitoring reasoning and activations in RL while pausing problematic runs seems like that exact form of pressure. The use of activation classifiers in training is especially unusual.
The recent Noam Brown interview definitely makes a stronger claim:
every time you intervene based on your observations of the chain of thought, you are implicitly applying a tiny bit of pressure for the model to then hide its chain of thought. This is one major concern. We’re already seeing signs that chain-of-thought monitorability is degrading, for various reasons.
Most importantly, having this as a standard going forward means that the number of "interventions" scales with the amount of time monitors/reasoners are exposed to an environment. If this is the framework for all training going forward, you would expect each invervention to add to a stack of "tiny bit[s] of pressure".
My guess: the crux is that the actions based on the monitoring system are supposed to pause entire RL runs, as opposed to penalizing bad trajectories within a group. Evolutionary pressure is probably slow, or may require something like exploration hacking from a scheming model. But this still feels like a dangerous amount of intervention given today's capabilities, especially since the information in this article will likely end up in the pretraining corpus of a future model. Haskins, Chughtai and Engels suggests that this accelerates obfuscation against CoT in today's open models.
Another explanation is that "available reasoning" means something other than "chain of thought." But using activation classifiers on every sampled token is certainly a somewhat Forbidden Technique?
It would be good if OpenAI could clear up their stance on this. I don't think this explains Astra being less monitorable, unless it turns out that this new monitoring framework caused meaningful changes to its the post-training pipeline.
Statement: some unreleased frontier model is, at time of writing, exploiting an undiscovered set of vulnerabilities while performing some long-horizon task, and we have not caught this act.
I hold P(statement is true) at 25-33% (i.e. in 1 of ~3-4 worlds). How about you?
EDIT to clarify prose:
"long-horizon task" = session inference served continuously for 6+ hours of wall clock time
"we have not caught this act" = no human being has noticed or been made aware of this exploitation
And the humans directing this task are probably unaware of this act?
I don't understand the statement, specifically, the meaning of "for a long-horizon task" or "we have not caught this act".
provided some clarifications, thank you!
for those reading this in the future, i wrote this in response the following news: https://openai.com/index/hugging-face-model-evaluation-security-incident/
I don't know how likely it is that we find techniques which recover generalizable motivation profiles from model organisms. It could be an absence of evidence, and not an evidence of absence, but structurally it feels hard to get even partial progress.
This is because (1) model organisms induce a "reader response" where observability in the organism is mutually exclusive with generalization; (2) model organisms optimized to mimic true behaviors face a distinct optimization trajectory.
A nice analogy emerges from the Borges short story "Pierre Menard, Author of the Quixote".
The narrator recalls Menard's 13-year quest to re-write Don Quixote, word for word, without reading the text (à la infinite monkey theorem). Menard, remarkably, manages to replicate a few chapters. The narrator proceeds to "analyze" their distinct qualities (the texts are identical).
My favorite passage:
It is a revelation to compare the Don Quixote of Pierre Menard with that of Miguel de Cervantes. Cervantes, for example, wrote the following (Part I, Chapter IX):
...truth, whose mother is history, rival of time, depository of deeds, witness of the past, exemplar and adviser to the present, and the future's counselor.
This catalog of attributes, written in the seventeenth century, and written by the "ingenious layman" Miguel de Cervantes, is mere rhetorical praise of history.
Menard, on the other hand, writes: ... truth, whose mother is history, rival of time, depository of deeds, witness of the past, exemplar and adviser to the present, and the future's counselor.
History, the mother of truth!—the idea is staggering. Menard, a contemporary of William James, defines history not as a delving into reality but as the very fount of reality. Historical truth, for Menard, is not "what happened"; it is what we believe happened. The final phrases—exemplar and adviser to the present, and the future's counselor—are brazenly pragmatic.
The irony captures two layers of the problem. The first layer is that these interpretive distinctions are exclusively from context and not from observed behavior. The implication of this is that the "scope" a model organism says more about us than about the real thing it models. The narrator is more aware of the properties of Menard than of Cervantes, and can speak more to them.
The second layer: the amount of optimization pressure we place on model organisms to act like "the real thing" trades off with the ability to generalize developmental claims. It is hard to use Menard's reproduction of Quixote to judge his belief on "historical truth" – who knows what other versions of the metaphor failed the rejection-sample of facsimile?
The story: https://raley.english.ucsb.edu/wp-content/Engl10/Pierre-Menard.pdf
Recent news about a team hacking OpenAI and under-elicitation of Hacker Opus imply a similar thing: current sparks of RSI are incomplete for alignment and control. AIs may miss things due to failures of imagination, even they may straightforwardly be called AGI. This statement presumes that both Anthropic and OpenAI teams have begun to integrate their strongest internal models into their day-to-day work.
In cases where intelligence is precipitated by creativity or unpredictable settings. In this sense, randomness and diversity might be a key precursor to safe RSI (beyond stronger conceptual reasoning)