Previous posts (which you should read first)

This post is the 5th post in a series of 11 posts about the claims of Sam Altman's sister, Annie Altman. Annie has claimed that Sam sexually abused her for about 9 years as a child, and that she experienced further (non-sexual) abuse from Sam, her brothers, and her mother after that.

The 11 posts are meant to be read in order.

So, if you haven't read the first 4 posts, please read them, in order, before you read this post:

Sam Altman's sister claims Sam sexually abused her -- Part 1: Introduction, outline, author's notes
Sam Altman's sister claims Sam sexually abused her -- Part 2: Annie's lawsuit; the response from Sam, his brothers, and his mother; Timeline
Sam Altman's sister claims Sam sexually abused her -- Part 3: Timeline, continued
Sam Altman's sister claims Sam sexually abused her -- Part 4: Timeline, continued

Timeline, continued

April 23, 2019: Annie publishes the 25th episode of her podcast: 25. Have fun putting yourself out there with Tania Contreras

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Annie Altman (0:00): Mmm. Hello and welcome to the Annie Altman. Show the podcast formerly known as true shit. My name is Annie Altman and I really enjoy asking people questions about what this whole Being Human Experience is like for them. This podcast is field research for the humanity. Stand up, comedy musical, philosophy, show about how no one ever fully knows how to be a human being. If you're listening to this, now you're fortunate enough to choose your truth. I choose to believe that objectivity is the sum of subjectivities meaning humans, collectively create truth. Today, I'm here with Tanya Contreras talking about having fun putting yourself out there. Tanya and her sister own facing Beauty Studios a school for makeup artists. Tanya also does Boda Boudreau photography and this is her first time on a podcast. Putting herself out there in this new way. Thank you so much Tanya for being here.
Annie Altman (6:15): fun. Yes, that is what we're here to talk about is having fun putting yourself out there and I love that you brought up time and rushing. I, I'm a big believer that rushing is one of the silliest things that I do ever. I'll like talk myself through it. When I start feeling that rushing of like I gotta be here at this time. I got to do this thing at this time and To go back to accountability deadlines can be helpful for being accountable and also they're definitely can. It's to me, it's a practice of boundaries, and at a certain point, you can restrict yourself so much. And I really, I really agree about that mindset of, like, I gotta get to this thing. And that thing is not fun for anybody. And the things that come from, it are not fun, because they're not coming from,
Annie Altman (7:51): yeah, this this exact recording is a great example of this because of both of our ends needing to delay and the podcast getting taken down because I Tunes is not here for any cussing and changing the name, and all of these things. And definitely has been a practice for me and letting things unfold and play out as they're gonna play out. And what I was thinking, when you were saying that is wondering that She's saying, you know, trusting basically the yoga philosophy as I've seen of, trust the process trust, that things are gonna work out that they are currently working out. And I'm curious how much of quote having fun has to do with Letting that happen stopping. Some of the need to control and make all these deadlines and make all of these boundaries and things. And then because I know for me, I'll notice things more when I control things less because I have more space to notice things and so I can have more space to have fun because I'm not like just the podcast has to. I mean, I fucking did that and I was like the podcast has to come out on this day and then I was like the podcast has to come out on this day. And then I was like, you know, that's not what's currently happening in reality, and that's okay. And like you said, there's reasons for it and I love the the metaphor of driving of Detours can lead you to all sorts of things or not taking that exit. Takes you pass something else. You wouldn't have seen
Annie Altman (30:21): tangent. Something I've been reflecting on with this. Is whether or not things? Quote, always have to be fun. So I well, I do feel very confident in prioritizing fun and I know that Life. Feels fun when I prioritize fun. I also feel like in thinking somebody's things that you're saying and my own experience of things that like you were talking about certain learning experiences that are uncomfortable or even painful in the moment and then really stick with you and can help you to grow. And so, Some way, this kind of reminds me someone in college who said something to me about non-attachment that I responded to, with something about how attachment to non-attachment is still attachment. So, it's kind of this, there's no there's no getting away from anything. so, I wonder at a certain point if I get really attached to fun and having everything be fun then I run the risk of closing myself off from learning from things that aren't fun. And I, I'm that's kind of where I'm at. In my head right now is the balance between letting that be a priority and And really trusting the part of me that feels good prioritizing that well also and this is my own tendency to get into really extremist black and white thinking and get really obsessive about things where it's like, okay, well then everything has to be super fun all the time and can only happen if it's really, really fun. And to me that's that's just going to The Other Extreme. It's just like the pendulum going from one side to the other you're following here. So I'm wondering I guess all of this talking around to say How do you, how do you personally find the sort of balance between? When you push yourself out of your comfort zone a little bit. And when you follow the fun,
Annie Altman (34:32): Thank you for sharing that. I like that one a lot. I like that one a lot because it comes with Coming in, with the intention, to have fun, the intention to put yourself out there, letting things flow, as they will, as they do, and having your intention be to leave having fun, and then all in my again, extremist my head places going to coming into the world and leaving the world birth and death and coming in. Like you come out
Annie Altman (37:10): I'm excited, I'm jumping right of like because I've had this sometimes where I've cried and then all like laugh at it with it about the whole thing, or I'm jumping with excitement about like when you're crying rather than being like Oh I'm the worst. I'm so emotional. I'm so weak, I'm so whatever. Like fuck, yeah, I'm feeling things, I'm human, I'm here, I'm alive. I give fuck's about things
Annie Altman (37:47): It is. Okay. And again, coming back to what you're saying about Detachment and not. Getting so attached to whatever the feeling is that comes up. Someone told me recently that biologically speaking. Feelings are only in your body for 90 seconds.
Tania Contreras (38:02): Wow, talk about being dramatic.
Annie Altman (38:05): I know. Talk about like extremism and stuff again. Yeah. And then we hold on to it and it festers, and we make stories and we attached to whatever

April 24, 2019 -- Annie publishes "Girl on Fire" by Alicia Keys // a capella cover on her YouTube channel.

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From the caption of the YouTube video:
- "Learning to love the sound of my own voice is a weird and fun process."

April 30, 2019: Annie publishes the 26th episode of her podcast: 26. Date yourself first with Taylor McPherson

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Annie Altman (8:24): Getting pigeon pose, you're opening up some emotional something and you're like, what,
Annie Altman (14:07): I find stuff like that. I did it. It was I thought helpful it was Was fun. It was interesting. Did a like a little over a year ago now and, It's it's a fine line. Like all things of kind of the spectrum of having intentions having ideas, having a Idea having ideas about your boundaries and things that you want. And I'm hesitant to say the word expectation and I'm gonna say it anyways. And I'm reminded of someone who I talk to in college about attachment and nonattachment and eventually kind of came around to. Hey, Attachment to non-attachment, as a practice is still attachment. You're still attached to something much like people who worship science. In a spiritual way, which I also did that one. And its, like, you're not getting away from the thing that you're wanting to get away from. I think,
Annie Altman (17:48): I went from no dating experience to one very long. Day experience.
Taylor McPherson (17:52): Okay. And how old are you at this place?
Annie Altman (17:55): We start dating when I was 16.
Annie Altman (17:57): And then went to different colleges split up. And then I didn't date for like two, three years. Then I had a like short, very intense relationship with someone else. Those are like those are those are the two people I've really loved. And I've had other people who I loved and loved and have had other relationships, other connections with, and A recently went through the longest period of my life without having any dates, any sex, anything. Since I first started any of that. Wow, that was a learning. It was, and it was parts of it were intentional and parts of it kind of just happened. Yeah. It was just like, kind of things. Like you were saying with work of just, there were other things that were more interesting to me. I was also, I just gotten off birth control so I'm taking an antidepressant and my hormones and my whole regulation were like we we need some time here to to breathe and I've just been getting into and being back here in to dating and meeting people and like going on apps or meeting friends of friends. And it's an interesting, it's an interesting time. So in my, I guess, uncomfortable this to talk about my own dating history. I'm Curious, if you heard of the comedian, Daniel sloth and him talkin' this, the stand-up special, he did called jigsaw
Annie Altman (20:49): And that's the thing in relationships. And I definitely that that video really hit home for me of Of not. Honestly, for me, personally more. I I feel like I bought into the idea that I was responsible for someone else's happiness. And I definitely also bought into the this Partners responsible for my happiness on a certain level. That I, I find, I found I've reflected in therapy in life and all of the things that, for me, the dysfunctional part was more that I really believed that I couldn't influence that person's happiness.
Annie Altman (25:45): such a loaded word. I mean, relationships, all of these things even like dating, I feel like it's like the first time I heard the word puberty not as like aaahhhh. Did you have that move?
Taylor McPherson (25:55): Not really?
Annie Altman (25:58): You didn't feel awkward the first or like uncomfortable about it. You were like yeah. Okay my body's changing?
Annie Altman (26:14): interesting. So I want to come back back closer to dating yourself because something else that I was thinking. It was a roommate that I had a conversation with. Shout out to Beth. I love you about this idea that she was talking about really wanting to like fully know herself before, like, you know, really like deal with your own stuff. And what I said, to her that something we've like, since talked about in her now, being in a relationship, Is. The idea of us all being Works in progress, so to speak so much, like, no one ever fully has a moment of like, yeah, I figured out to be a human being, I know exactly how to be a human and I figured it out.
Annie Altman (26:54): also not going to be a moment. I don't believe that all say. Yeah I have fully figured myself out enough and dating myself enough that I am ready to date someone else. Now you know I mean like that's not gonna
Annie Altman (27:10): it keeps happening. You keep dating yourself. Well, you're dating people and again it's doing what feels good when it feels good. It's just another example of things. Not being for me. It was like just having certain things in place I guess. Like, where am I
Annie Altman (32:43): yeah, well I'm the another cliche that is true is 🟡awareness, is the first step being aware that you're putting that wall up and being like, oh shit. I just totally emotionally blocked myself off entirely from this space.🟡 Yeah.
Annie Altman (41:23): This idea of like oh you know wanting to be so excited and wanting all of this stuff and for me as a very excitable person I feel more attracted to people who I feel relaxed around. I feel like my heart is fiery like that. Like semi heart on fire help my heart calm down.
Annie Altman (43:28): Yeah, yeah and and it can get scary I think I think it's again a human nature to run away from things sometimes. Yeah. Run away from something of it eventually. I think I hope I feel that We just we keep experimenting. Yeah. Figuring it out. Yeah. In the same way that we do with ourselves, Again, at least for me it comes to the control. It comes to the Being vulnerable to other opinions and perspectives, and things that I have no influence over
Annie Altman (47:17): Hey, thanks for sticking around till the end. Please check out the Annie Altman show.com for blogs music and more information about the humanity. Oh Manny also, please check out patreon.com backslash The Annie Altman show if you are able and interested in donating a dollar or more per month towards these projects, And if you're still listening, please say something nice about yourself.

April 30, 2019: Annie publishes the 27th episode of her podcast: 27. Sums are greater than parts with Devin Collins

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Annie Altman (13:22): That language so much another equation. I'm here, I'm here for extended metaphors. Just keep pulling it, pushing it. And see what happens. It's interesting. The It being each part being important and each part. Being sometimes, I think about something with group dynamics often of how And I can in five person group dynamic, any one person not being there, really changes it a lot and in such weird and interesting ways. Humans psychology. Like we were talking about before recording of sociology and why we're doing these psychological behaviors and
Annie Altman (23:34): I mean 100% stereo types. Go I I call astrology stereotypes that. Hold true. I'm a big believer in any personality. Anything I really I used to love Myers Briggs, I've gotten into any Instagram or recently than I have totally nerd out on reading about the overlap between astrology and the any Graham and Meyers Briggs and At the end of the day, where I come back to on all of this is that labels are helpful harmful. And any, any practice that is helping someone to reflect like to me the worst case scenario of someone hearing something about their zodiac. Like some stereotype, there's zodiac sign. Is there like yeah, that doesn't resonate with me. And then you've learned that Like that, that to me is the worst, not, okay, that is a worst case scenario. The ultimate worst thing to me of anything is being dogmatic about it. So people being like, To go to sums in Parts. Like oh you're you're zodiac sign your zodiac chart explains, everything about you as a person or everything about that. I don't hang out with this sign or that like, oh well I did this because of my Venus and whatever and it's like that's a part perhaps it's why you that thing happened. Yeah. It's not the whole it's not the whole thing
Annie Altman (25:41): or to go to sums in Parts. Maybe say that that's just a part that you'd maybe be interested in and maybe your boyfriend is going to be who is what sign or that he'll have Aries energy as they say, which I say in a sarcastic voice. But I do mean that is true of people can have an overall Vibe about them and maybe it's like a theory. Can you personally? Yeah, I mean there's things in all we can talk, I will gladly talk about astrology. For me, I see astrology as a part of the sum, as it's another tool. It's another and honestly it's just fucking fun like more and more I'm coming to I'm just going to do stuff that's fun because it's fun. And right now for me astrology is fun. I used to be like this is the dumbest shit. Like honestly a past version of me would have turned this podcast off as soon as astrology came up, like fuck that shit. That's not science if you heard of astronomy. And yeah, so So now, I love those The Vine videos. It's a part to me. So it's just it's another part of life to explore. It's also a part that's been around for so long. and I personally am a believer in there being something extra to learn and that doesn't necessarily mean like a better or worse thing. That things that have stuck around for a long time. Have stuck around for a reason. So to me, those are Parts, extra worth examining.
Annie Altman (33:36): love that in terms of how it can influence your actions. I love the Love Languages and I've actually made the joke or made of type of joke of basically feeling like if I can know someone's Myers Briggs and astrology chart and any Graham and Love Languages, then I can just make all these assumptions about this person's actions that I'm gonna put them in the box of based on those things and it's helpful to have some framework of perhaps why someone would do something or what they want or really. How you can support them to me as is what it comes down to and it's a similar thing of like talking about your childhood, and where you grew up, where its context. And so, of course, those things are going to manifest differently. Are going to look different or not. Always going to follow exact patterns of like, oh, you're this, you're Sagittarius. You're gonna do all of like, this is exactly how everything is like, fuck that. And all. So I I'm glad you brought up Love Languages because if I were to prioritized, the different ways of Having some idea about making guesswork of someone. That's the one I pick because that's the one that yeah that's the one that most influences, my interactions. I feel like or I'll say that. There's a lot to be said, for me about Simplicity and that to me is the simplest one.
Annie Altman (39:28): I think this is beautiful. My, my dad passed away my dad died almost a year ago last May and, talk about love language with him and and also how my understanding of love and love languages has shifted and a bold in the grieving process and go to astrology again. As part of being more open-minded to literally everything. and,
Annie Altman (42:36): Wow, that's a great. Thank you so much for sharing that story I Am the signed my dad sends the symbol. He seems to be sending and much like astrology a past me would have Very harshly, judged a sentence like that, my dad sends bunnies,
Annie Altman (42:54): and I've had some really goofy like I was sitting outside when I first moved here, eating somewhere. And I look up and there's a license plate that said bunny with three ends and I was like, little bit. Yeah, like, I've been walking and seeing a bunny, I mean, now, with Easter, obviously, those are different like, you know, like a bunny figurine that I saw randomly, I was walking with a friend. After getting a meal and we went by this furniture store and the only there was a table and the only decoration on the table, was a ceramic bowl with a ceramic Bunny inside of it.
Annie Altman (43:27): It was so cool. It's

By ~May 2019 [EW23a], Annie has become sick with a combination of illnesses that make it hard for her to work [AA24b, AA23k, AA--f, AA--g, AA23m, EW23a, AA23r].

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Annie's illnesses include:
- PCOS (Polycystic ovary syndrome)
- A flare-up of her IBS (Irritable bowel syndrome)
- Achilles tendinopathy and posterior tibial tendinopathy (aka posterior tibial tendon dysfunction), for which she has to go into a walking boot, for the 3rd time in 8 years.
  - 1st time: Achilles tendinopathy and a bone spur
  - 2nd time: Achilles tendinopathy
  - (this) 3rd time: Achilles tendinopathy and posterior tibial tendinopathy
- Tonsillitis
- Sources: [AA24b, AA23k, AA--f, AA--g, AA23m, EW23a]

May 14, 2019: Annie publishes the 28th episode of her podcast: 28. Perspective creates content with Alena Bernardi

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Annie Altman (27:37): yeah. I I love having that perspective of who created content. I actually was something often in high school English classes. That I get really curious about the author because I want to like what and what, what was your influence? What was really the inspiration? The passion behind whatever this thing was that you created and some teachers really supported that in some teachers. Like, it doesn't matter. It's just about the art. And as I'm saying this, I'm kind of thinking about how people do that. Same thing with everything, right? They'll do it with like Kanye or musical artist or Bill Clinton and other things where it's like do separate the job from the life. Do you? It's a good question? I mean that could be like
Annie Altman (28:53): saw some quote through that makes me think about of How art is? Showing people how you're seeing the world, it's giving people opportunity to see things. How you're seeing?
Annie Altman (42:08): women. Specifically, is that women Have more pressure. I'll say to never be ugly or messy or any of those things. And male characters, get a much wider perspective, they're allowed to embody and portray which is then more true to actually being a human and women are also humans so they also have that wide. You can be very pretty and very ugly, too.
Annie Altman (43:01): or like the Middle School thing of like or like Elementary School of like women don't like girls don't poop or like women. Women don't like, you know, we all the same fucking digestive tract, right? Like we are really similar as human, but again, just our perspectives are really not
Annie Altman (54:18): now I feel like there's this kind of rebalancing where in people being like Oh yeah sex and gender are different and things are spectrums and even you can have even even chromosomally. It's not as simple as xx and XY as that's getting recognized people are recognizing. Oh yeah, I have masculine and feminine in me. 🟡Sometimes I want to Run and yell and scream and sometimes I want to cry and watch a Disney movie even because it reminds me my childhood, you know what I mean? Like we all, we all have all parts.🟡 Yeah, we all have all the perspective. In US. Some real, like, end of the yoga class stuff. I believe in.
Annie Altman (55:08): mean that more. That was like, going into very like, woo. We have the perspectives in us, but we're not exposed to them. Yeah. Which is then, really where art is, okay, expose us to the other perspective, right? I mean and and on like an overtly dramaticized level, but that's the beauty of it, right. Yeah. Because it makes it, I think more accessible. I was just gonna say, it has to be able to access the emotion when it's overly dramaticized. Yeah. And it's more engaging. Yeah. And it's more engaging than you actually want to watch it. Yeah, to start it because you can have that release of that big thing you had, and it's such a way to learn about. I mean, that all so many people, learn about different groups from media, even in an improv classes. They talk about like, oh, have you seen a representation of that in something? So, that's where we're drawing our ideas of perspective from like, oh yeah, I've seen, And then sometimes that stuff gets so warped. Yeah. And then this is why it's important to be intentional about how that content is created because then it's putting out a perspective that then people are shaping their perspectives about,
Annie Altman (56:58): Comes to like what everyone is doing with art is unlearning and relearning are subconscious programming. Yeah, yeah. Totally sitting with it and being like, wait, why do I have that impulse? Yeah, something, yeah. Let's go in the Maze a little more. Create some content with our perspective? Yes. Because that's all we got to create with. Yeah,

May 21, 2019: Annie publishes the 29th episode of her podcast: 29. Drop your punchlines with Sam Brilhart

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Annie Altman (11:51): great life of helping make future drafts for that. I see what you're saying though. That makes me think of again yeah. Dropping dropping the expectation of What you think something's going to be in. The other thing that made me think of is the maybe the metaphor of punchline for your patterns and your behaviors and the things that you do regularly and then the ways like you're saying with the relationship and you sort of interaction, like I think that's totally comes up in romantic relationships and family relationships. The most where At least in my experience. I've boxed myself in to a certain pattern of these are my punchline. These are how this is how I do things like these are what I do rather than Having more variety in the punch lines or that letting them change. I don't know, I didn't expect this punchline metaphor that I really see it as behavioral patterns because when I look when I think about comedians, they have patterns to their punchlines. They have themes like the sort of fit part of their persona.
Annie Altman (22:00): I like to say net positive often like how are you net, positive things are are mostly joyful. I I cried this morning too, let's normalize talking about crying and I love that you brought in the wheel to look and to have all these helpful words to To describe feelings. Oh yeah, I'm still a straight white, man. I don't know all of them. That would be good, that would be a good bit. You could go on stage and you can do like I printed out this emotion wheel because as a straight white man, especially in these trying times for my people.
Annie Altman (22:32): I'm need to learn how to discuss my emotions.
Annie Altman (32:16): I feel like that's a common comedy Trope, the more I think, you know, like people like, oh airplane's, oh this thing. Like starting at hey, this thing that we all feel is like a mild inconvenience in our lives or something. That gets an emotional response. well, the other thing with those examples are there, there are things that get an emotional response without Generally, without getting really caught in it, like it gives an emotion without it being one of those overwhelming emotions that just takes over everything because then he can't really get out of that. Like, I feel like part of to use your thing about the emotion wheel and moving through it, Starting with motions that are easier to move through. But also then like what you were saying earlier about emotions and life in your day-to-day, doesn't matter where you're starting. Even if you're in something that is quote-unquote heavier, you can still move. Throughout the day and in jokes too.
Sam Brilhart (34:41): that's our guys get stuck sometimes because they can't Label it real quick. I'm speaking for everybody more. Speaking for myself. I can't label that emotion real quick. When it is so, hey, what's wrong? If somebody like senses it, hey, what's wrong? I don't leave me alone for a second. What is it? What is like? I just don't know. I'm sorry,
Annie Altman (35:02): that's so real. I relate to that, too. That's for emotions, are really tricky.
Annie Altman (35:16): That's so true. A lot of times I feel like when people say it's Fine. Sometimes they're just wanting to. Avoid talking about the thing. And a lot of times I feel like people say it's fine because they don't know what other word to say. They're just like, I don't it's fine because I have no other word here. that's an interesting say, say more, if you have more about that kind of confusion and maybe how I feel like writing comedy is one way to find a little bit of clarity in it because you could practice in situations and then labeling the feeling
Annie Altman (36:09): Yeah, I mean I that to me is a such a relatable At least I can completely relate to that all. So if people being like what's going on or what's whatever or me asking myself, what's going on and not having a word for it? Yeah. So caught up in the motion, maybe that you're that. I'm unaware of what it is.
Annie Altman (48:12): It's good for coming and talking about punchlines for a little bit and thank you for all. So letting this be kind of not kind of totally free floaty and less straight questions of things. I feel like you have a lot of interesting insights about connecting. Our emotional experiences with how we convey that in comedy, which I feel like comes up in all art forms, we're just getting our emotions and our perspectives out there.
Annie Altman (49:07): you the same. Damn, there's a lot in there, too. Yeah, I'm here. I'm here for this. I am here for this. Wow, yes. And I find more and more. I'm a believer that emotions are guidance. That feelings are guide and the same. As with thoughts, not all your thoughts are true. Not all your feelings are true. You have to buy in, you don't have to attach to them, you can drop your feelings, you can let go of the thing and all. So
Annie Altman (49:43): yeah, yes, yes. And for me, that is using my feelings as guided. helps me to drop them for for me like having some use of them or yeah, like knowing that they're doing something or or just the like they're leading towards something or that they're traveling along somewhere to me. For whatever that's worth helps me like go. Of being so attached to them or getting so rigidly caught up in like well what do they mean? Or what do they whatever? Cuz it's Gonna Change. Like they're here to help me now to get a little and Like part of, you know, people who all asked to be on this podcast, are people to all talk to is it does it feel good to talk to them? That's Very subjective just emotional. How do I feel talking to this person? Do I feel like I could sit in my kitchen comfortably and chat with them about something?
Annie Altman (50:41): And that is to me letting my feelings. Guide. What I what I choose to do.

May 28, 2019: Annie publishes the 30th episode of her podcast: 30. Fierce gentleness with Christine Quigless

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Annie Altman (11:53): Very interesting. Oh, I like that. I like that a lot. All we can do is with the reality and what you said about our brain being a closed circuit that it's surprising to me that I've been surprised that I'm like weed. I can't figure out truth just by thinking about it. And this brings me to yoga and things that you can talk about Theory as much as you want. And there's a huge difference between talking about it and just doing it, just living it being it move, just move. Yeah, do the practice. So the last question for everybody coming on is, why did you agree to come on? Why did you agree to come share some of your truth here in the kitchen.
Annie Altman (15:42): yeah, yeah, I remember talking about that with you and then I from December {2018} until This last month, when at this recording, I took I took a few months off from doing the podcast and I I needed a kind of a similar like taking back and reflecting. I was thinking also of that when you're talking about Like my birthday label and how that comes in. Mine is reformed Big Bang. Whoa. One comes in. Some of the things on there, too. I remember there's some line that something like people born on this day, like calmly call into question, certain axiomatic truths, not for like contrariness as much as like they really studied and felt about things a lot and they wanted to talk about it. And I was like, that's Yeah. Okay, cool. Very cool. Very cool. Yeah, I'm really glad that you agreed to come and talk about it and and I get to hear about all these different projects and how they how they overlap and also just talking with you and being around your Fierce gentleness, that, that you put out there where you are, you are yourself, and you are your feminine, you are excitable. You are, you'll go through all the emotions, you'll let them out in a gentle way. That is There's room for other people's emotions, and there's room to pause and listen, and be flexible and to play around. And yeah, it's very, it's very fiercely gentle to, to feel to be around
Annie Altman (34:28): It's out there. that's, those those moments to I find also can be ways to give ourselves that confidence to prove to ourselves in some way that we're stronger. That were more capable that were more fiercely gentle than we're giving ourselves credit for to, then be able to tell this story. And, yeah, stories could go too far and we can get attached to stories and all of that and also stories can be a way to help ourself talk be more. Hey, remember you? You did that thing. Hey, remember when you were able to put your ego aside for a moment and really receive some super helpful advice, that then really was super helpful in practice. Like you did that little, I have a friend who we started as a saying sarcastically and now say mostly seriously have her for you. For you, you did that. You you were there, okay? And then the other thing to keep going for a moment here, that I was thinking of with your gentleness with this was Them supporting each other. So again to the trees, they'll be one moment that one trees kind of bending more towards the other one. And one moment that the other cheese bending a little more similar with relationships. It's no relationship of any sort, is net equal all the time or is equal in every moment? It's, it's net equal. Yeah,
Annie Altman (35:50): this idea of in that moment you were You are you are gentle in that you were receptive, you stood and you received and you listened and you were fierce in that you stood there you didn't run away from it and you didn't shut down and tune them out. and then there can also be the times when you are Fierce and communication. And you bring in that gentleness to support it and be loving and compassionate with fierceness.
Annie Altman (47:36): what is that mean? Because we're all gonna die,
Christine Quigless (47:39): right? Right. But you can you can you can we're all headed that way as Joe said in one class were all, this is a long ornate, Death March.
Annie Altman (47:51): Oh, that's some dark humor. I love that. The Ram Dass quote or I'll walking each other home. Perhaps on a, on a long ornate, Death March.
Annie Altman (52:41): it does and it's interesting too because I find for me that reality is way less scary and sad and isolating and all of those things then 🔴🔴🔴My head, my mind will come up my central nervous system on. A huge Spike will come up with things that are way more terrifying than reality ever is.🔴🔴🔴

June 4, 2019: Annie publishes the 31st episode of her podcast: 31. Entertainment as art and service with Lesley Greer

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Annie Altman (4:14): Yeah, that's such an easier said than done to really listen to yourself and give yourself the space to listen to yourself.
Annie Altman (5:16): Yeah, that's why I agreed, I love it. I love it. Yeah, I am a believer in Talking shoot in the shit. Well, it has this connotation of your just shooting the breeze. You're Never gonna get anywhere. It often surprises me and I get places. I would not have gotten too or I really didn't even know. I wanted to go to. Yeah,
Annie Altman (14:20): feeling natural and just the natural. I'm thinking about art and service, and how Art is a service to yourself its own sort of therapy of yeah. Something to do. And then I maybe that's part of the service that gets provided
Annie Altman (24:27): challenging balance, it is when to let things go and when you hold on, and when to keep, yeah, keep on. Yeah. Totally. And again, this comes to, you know, only, you know, your truth, only you can You know, trial and error your truth and see. Okay, how did this feel to hold on to how'd that feel to let go of? Yeah. What did I learn? Yeah, the next time which might be a totally different situation.
Annie Altman (25:32): on keepin', on keepin' on. Well, something I think of two with. So Art and service are think well. art is something that at some level you're doing for you and you're not like it's a thing that you just do because you want to, because you need to for my to speak for my personal experience. It's a I'm making things because I need to, because, or, because of, like this is what's happening. Like, not even a neat like this is This is just the thing of it.
Annie Altman (36:19): it is. It's really I loved what you said about getting to see poses in different bodies or getting to see a lot of bots, like seeing a lot of bodies in the same pose in the noticing Trends, and it's so helpful for your own practice for your queuing, for your all of it. And, and just getting to notice the different experience people. The different experiences people are having, or kind of, like, saying with the different Services people can offer the different things, people's bodies can offer can learn can do in different ways. They think of a dance teacher, who would talk about how How different people's movement Styles and bodies they'd have different flowers and there'd be different flowers in a performance. And yeah, it's just that one moment. That one movement, that how that person does, it how it feels looks. Something about how it's coming off in their body is just like, whoa. Yeah, so cool, you can't look away. You're like you said about the hushed crowd kind of yeah, kind of a moment and and what we can all learn from each other by getting to see like well look at your side angle. Look at yours. Like oh, that's cool. How does that feel in your left? Yeah,

June 11, 2019: Annie publishes the 32nd episode of her podcast: 32. Realism, optimism, and pessimism with Anthony Lambinus

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Annie Altman (10:08): but Well, to bring up optimism pessimism, it can be. I find very easy and tempting to go to those extremes of, I'm the worst person ever, I'm the best person ever. They're the best person ever. They're the worst person ever. The situation is the best of the worst, whatever that thing is rather than seeing the realness of it. Which in that example is oh the situation happened. Here's what happened in the past, which I cannot change. Here's what I can do in the future because of it and something you'll also said too about stepping out of your comfort zone is a great transition to why did you agree to come and share some of your truth here? When I was like Hey and the knee, I've seen you around, we talked before about stuff. You want to talk about something on the podcast and you said yes why.
Annie Altman (18:33): And what I've found in my experience of coming to understand my truth through practicing. It is I'm someone who really likes to go to the boundary needs to touch the wall to know it's there and then go back from there and something that we were discussing about and you were just discussing about being real with emotions. And this idea of optimism, pessimism is sort of extreme points on emotions and then realism as this Extreme Baseline without emotion, without much, emotional expression. And the graph that I was drawing out before we recorded about feelings over time that Is a graphite talk about. Pretty often for watching. 🟡This is a graph about My my personal experience as someone who's felt things, really extremely going from super high highs to super low lows and then slowly that curve evenings out getting less, less extreme less bumpy. and smoother and then the other extreme of that of just emotional Baseline that are What I was thinking was like flatlining to me, that's when you're when that graph is a flatline, you're dead. You're not feeling anything.🟡
Annie Altman (19:48): also, 🟡if you're always spiking, the highest and lowest points on the graph, you're gonna die pretty soon. Like you're you're life. It is from my experience can be harder to feel like you're really living even though it could seem maybe like you really living because they're such extremes. I don't know. What would you say your graph has been like, like my reflection. I get from you now is that you're someone who's has like a pretty smooth emotional up and down, like, you're not like doing Spikes🟡
Annie Altman (27:49): Well and that makes me think of burnout among activists Healers of the whole healer umbrella of sort of medical professional eastern western any and because living in full empathy all the time. in my experience of At least, what I believe is that experience of? I'm really in this mindset in this place is exhausting, like is not sustainable, because then you're always picking up someone else's McDonald's cup.
Annie Altman (40:28): in here. There's a lot in there. So I want to get on some of the things before I to keep to keep all the points in there. So, I grew up in Saint Louis. I grew up in Middle America Midwest. I went to school in the East Coast. Lived in the Bay area for a year live here now. So I feel like I've I feel very grateful that I've gotten to see. I lived on the big island of Hawaii for nine months. I'm really grateful for getting to see a lot of different perspectives of people.
Annie Altman (55:39): really resonated with what you were talking about with your experience with depression and reflecting on my experience is with my own mental health and What a distinction it is between. I want to do something low-key. First, I don't want to do anything. I don't want to participate to me, that's participate. Engage pay attention, be aware be there. And then for these moments of, like you're talking about these, what I what I said synchronicities of or just noticing these things, You have to engage two, notice them. Otherwise you're gonna miss all of them. And for me, that, that is the realism is the at a therapist say, once Embrace reality and that phrasing of it. And part of that is engaging it. Embracing it literally

June 18, 2019: Annie publishes the 33rd episode of her podcast: 33. Enlightenment for optimization with Sophia Arakelyan

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Annie Altman (0:25): and welcome to the Annie Altman. Show the podcast formerly known as true shit. My name is Annie Altman and I really enjoy asking people questions about what this whole Being Human Experience is like for them. This podcast is field research for the humani a stand-up comedy musical philosophy. Show about how no one ever fully knows how to be a human being. If you're listening to this now your fortunate enough to choose your truth. I choose to believe that objectivity is the sum of subjectivities meaning humans, collectively create truth. Today I'm here with Sophia are at kellian, talking about Enlightenment for optimization. Sophia was a scholar with OpenAI and is now doing her own startup in AI. She was a part of the Russian ballet, school and Company for 10 years and then was like, I'm gonna go and, you know, do Silicon Valley now. And now I am lucky enough to have her here in the kitchen. Talking about the sea Consciousness theme from the humanity Enlightenment for optimization. Welcome, Sophia, hi,
Annie Altman (16:58): totally well so that makes me think the part that you said about ignoring those different parts is So in my experience like not like in my experience. I have ignored parts and found that to be counterproductive. In the sense of don't think about pink elephants, and then I'm thinking about pink elephants. And what I find to be sort of the trick or the game is, how to acknowledge those parts. Acknowledge that very human like you were talking about judgment competition. You're a person of course that's going to come up in your mind and the more people are like I don't have an ego, the more. I'm like I'm not I'm uninterested talking to you about ego right now because my ego is really triggered by your yeah acting like you don't have one fellow human and It can also then go. to The Other Extreme where you're acknowledging, those judgments and then you identify with them and you attached to them and then that that's all kind of productive because you're not empty. You don't have that space for Whatever is going to come up to me, the word, Enlightenment. I think of light. I think of Shining Light on things and there's all sorts of spiritual philosophical. Even like optimization and Enlightenment have lots of different definitions and the different fields and to me at the end of the day, comes to shining a light. Where is your attention? Where is your? What am I focusing on? And that to your point of the different abstractions is how you can see them. Oh wow. I'm identifying with I'm a dancer. I'm a this that I'm doing this thing, this is how that conversation is going to go tomorrow and then being able to Step back to put some light on. Okay, well wait. What's actually reality?
Annie Altman (21:09): that Prince even more confusion, right? It's bringing another abstraction to say, well what is truth mean to you or to you. So to reiterate, I feel like what you're getting at there. Is the difference? of intention with ignoring things, I feel like what came up for me was ignores the neglect and avoid and I it seems like what you're talking about is more in the sense of How, how one would treat a dog? They were training or a child. They were babysitting and you acknowledge the behavior. You acknowledge. Like, let's say you're with a little kid and they're throwing a tempered. Tantrum, you're not going to ignore like that would be neglectful to not give any space to just act, like it's not happening. 🟠🟠And also at a certain point if you keep giving it tension to that temper, tantrum or to your own emotional inner, tempered tantrum, then that's where all your energy is going because you're just focusing on that rather than saying, hey, I see you. I acknowledge you. I validate you. Those feelings are human. I love you all of those self-talk to your inner self child🟠🟠 and then say, hey, I'm gonna put my attention on doing this podcast right now, on this, whatever this project is, whatever this moment is, and choosing like, makes me think of the Titan not Han about your attention, like a TV channel and picking which station you're on.
Annie Altman (31:00): 🟡Totally something that that brings up for in my experience is both of the two as someone who lives has lived her life as an extremist and bouncing between the walls and then figuring out what feels sustainable for me. Is either going to the extreme of. wanting everyone to think exactly how I think and see the world, how I see the world problem because everything is,🟡 yeah, that was like when I so when I did the pre-med route and I was in for me, that was part of like being in Academia really Strengthened that perspective for me, I was like how could anyone see anything differently than this perspective? And then I went to Other Extreme essentially invalidating. My perspective of Oh wow. There's all these other perspectives out here with all of these other experiences and why is mine relevant or interesting or at all. You know, how could my perspective contribute to anything? And honestly, those are I believe those are both ego in different ways. I feel like people shooting on themselves all the time, it's just as egotistical, as always, patting yourself on the back and
Annie Altman (34:31): planet In this moment, I feel very strongly that a big part of optimization is minimizing unnecessary suffering. I've always felt very passionate about food and people not having access to food as something. I have gone through many emotions of anger sadness, grief, all of all of the things. There's a lot of rage in there and confusion about we have plenty of food. There's always been plenty of food for every single human on the planet. And we haven't prioritized Distributing it. So to me, in the very tangible world and food being such a tangible example of People are not going to be able to be enlightened and optimize their lives and have fun if they don't have calories for their cells to use his fuel. Just that's not how human body's work. We are animals and I feel very strongly about that as a form of optimization. I guess what that opens up for me too is that I see optimization is things that open up more optimization, which I feel like is definitely not how you're supposed to define words.
Annie Altman (41:18): love that. I love that and just hear it and I love you talking about kind of what you're walking away from this conversation with. And for me, this whole Looking and Enlightenment too of light as fun is. is A New Perspective for me, that is something I've sort of understood logically and is making its way down from my head and to my actual whole body of feeling it and and your point about these things that we just feel that they're just in the air even if yeah we're just adding on other abstractions about truth and what this is and what that is and it's a, it's a goofy game of adding on abstractions and inviting people into this podcast to share their abstractions in order to also, then clear abstractions away for that emptiness and, and that is something all hold on to, ironically, of learning from this is That emptiness for other things to come in for fun to come in. Because if I'm controlling everything and wanting to know all the answers, there's no space. For things to optimize towards enjoyment.

June 25, 2019: Annie publishes the 34th episode of her podcast: 34. Choice is freedom with Schad Gibbons

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Annie Altman (2:48): This is where math can feel very comforting to have. What seems like more black and white rules about what is factual? What is truth. How did you come to understand your truth? And maybe share a little bit about Force 3 and how that comes into, Your your truth of choice in action.
Annie Altman (5:54): I love that too. With Yeah, and the openness to talk about that and how people use words differently and what comes up with, what we attached to the different words. He's I could see also in my head the the concept of holding your beliefs Loosely not gripping, so tightly onto, whatever you believe in rather than Yeah, go. You could make it negative or positive. So, why not make it neither, and just listen to what the person says. Yeah, why did you agree to come and share some of your truth?
Annie Altman (10:29): well, the part to me was You talking about how you felt about it. I feel like The, our bodies are great metaphors and great. guidance systems to what's going on with us and also, The. The ideas that a lot of people have about direct correlations between physical appearance, and Health and Wellness. I disagree with. I look more at how body feels and what? What a body can do. And even the can do, then can get into ableism and this can border into getting quote, two PC about things. And I do believe that your body composition is is relevant, that weight is a relevant thing and also the the hyper Focus, I find in health and fitness, On, you know, have a have a six pack have X percent body fat. I find. For me in the choice is I made got really compulsive in God. Unhealthy.
Annie Altman (15:40): I was on the other end of the spectrum doing five days of eating only papayas. Which also is a great cleanser not on his gassy as beans for me and also fruitarian raw vegan or their own. Their own different games. Different from me and I heard a potato diet. I'm always fascinated by The experimenting.
Annie Altman (19:07): exactly. First reflect and the rigidity of choice. I, I feel that as well, and the The feeling of being at a restaurant with people and feeling like, oh, I have these rules, rather than being a restaurant and being like, I'm so excited to be here and eat whatever's here with these people who are here.
Annie Altman (19:26): And it's an interesting. That's an interesting Paradox about choice. Is freedom and also the rigidity of choice and in diet in both of our experiences and on both of these extreme ends how I see it. Both sides say, I'm holier than thou because I'm only eating meat because I'm only eating fruit because I'm doing a juice cleanse because I'm doing Whole 30 because I'm because I lost all of this weight because I I gained like people put myself included all of these attachments on this physical. Shell. Probably because it's easier to do than to Be with whatever is not physical. And also going to that extreme of just being in the spiritual astral, whatever you want to call, it realm is then neglecting the body that is existing right here in this table and this get in and this physical space. so having the yes and for choice of it being freedom and also How it can create rigidity either self-imposed or also. Perhaps the overchoice with food in some ways, in my experience was what seemed to create some rigidity was I had all the options and so I felt this pressure to eat the perfect thing and to do to make the right quote on quote choice for my freedom of what's going to serve me to best optimize my my freedom so I can optimize other people's freedom and Cyclically optimize each other's in the world and putting all of this pressure on choice, rather than, you know, I loved the you bring up like cake at a party. 🟠🟠And in my like, for my experience too, with food, it really got into orthorexic of this Purity mentality and needing to eat quote, Pure Foods for Purity.🟠🟠
- 🟠🟠Note: see Orthorexia nervosa - Wikipedia🟠🟠
Annie Altman (21:49): when that. Okay. So here's a set question for you, how do you choose when you create those rigid boundaries of, for example, you know your, I'm gonna get up and work out every morning. I'm going to do this routine and when to be loose, with your choice is, how do you choose? So what it's
Annie Altman (24:59): Wow, there's a lot in there. To unpack. Let's talk about fasting a bit because I feel like that is the base of what I want to talk about with that of. We just, we discussed fasting and other practices and where the intention is with it. 🟡And I shared about some of my history with orthorexia with disordered eating tendency is about for me in that figuring out what I want and getting really clear about What? What, what do I want? What feels good for me. and the the why of why I'm doing something? So am I doing something out of love or hate for myself?🟡 🟠🟠Am I depriving myself of something to The inflict pain and harm on myself.🟠🟠 And I
Annie Altman (26:02): when for me in Where I am currently of. My food journey is to. Always come back to what my body wants as woo-woo. Is that might sound really tuning in to stomach my muscles. My whatever. And And asking. What I want, you know, eat the cake sometimes Maybe. like that can come up of not being super relatively with this of essentially what you talked about brought up Tendencies for minor things that I've gone through. Reflected thoughts and feelings. I've had and disordered ways. And what I am clumsily talking around here is how Things can look different for different people or people can say the same thing and have a different intention about it. And so, I guess one thing to I'm making any sense about like the why, you know, is this coming from a place of
Schad Gibbons (27:08): yes, like some people Force themselves, eat a salad because they said I'm fat.
Speaker 1 (27:13): Yes, I
Schad Gibbons (27:14): donuts. And I need a salad or and so they're they're seeing salad as being punishment for what they had done previously
Annie Altman (27:23): or not eating the ice cream is punishment for something as well.
Annie Altman (28:02): This makes me think of the difference between guilt and shame and the distinction between Guilt of I did something bad. That was bad versus shame of. I am bad and how that can then manifest influence that choice of
Annie Altman (32:43): Totally boundaries really comes up. A lot with Freedom and choice. And Reminds me again. I'm Things you said about the freedom that can come from having a structure and from learning about the structure of your body. How that's been empowering to you and how you Empower others through teaching that and giving people More leading people towards more questions about. About their body.
Speaker 1 (33:12): Yeah.
Schad Gibbons (33:13): And finding insight for the themselves.
Annie Altman (33:14): Yes. Using their body then to reflect on.
Schad Gibbons (33:17): Yeah. In sight, looking inside yourself by asking a question finding the answer inside.
Speaker 1 (33:25): Inside.
Annie Altman (33:27): I love all the correlations. between between different movement practices that all get down to The. what I, the perspective, I see of the yoga perspective of all your answers are inside of you and It's the same thing and all the things. Yeah,
Annie Altman (35:43): because that's something that I reflect on a lot in. Communicating with other people is that there's lots of layers of communication happening between your mind and body between my mind and body. And then those mind-body Communications are communicating Of course, that's going to be a mind. Fuck. And then of course, when you add in other people, or whole structures of people. So the thing that you said about, the difference of being more disciplined with yourself of having more structure and boundaries within you and your beliefs I'm going to say and more fluidity more looseness, in groups, to explore, seems for me, like a really helpful framework and take away of of letting it be both.
Annie Altman (38:02): not serving you. Yeah I really I I've got, I I love the exercise of journaling of making things of Using this Physical Realm, really? I really Iappreciate your appreciation of the physical and using it as a tool and embracing it and not not pushing it away in the same way of, you know, pushing away any feeling. Any Not judging perhaps this physical. Embodiment where we are and and just asking questions about it being curious about it. That's another one of the Seas of curiosity about about what's going on and and how how do we feel with it? How is this creating our life?
Annie Altman (40:33): whatever the things are. And I feel disconnected to myself because I'm not creating anything.

July 2, 2019: Annie publishes the 35th episode of her podcast: 35. Everyone is doing their best with Michelle McGregor

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Annie Altman (12:13): yeah, yeah, my truth on that is best is Doing what you believe, what? What I believe? Is the most aligned course of action for me, given the knowledge and experience I have when I'm making that decision about consciously or unconsciously about what I'm then navigating. So that is where some of that compassion comes in. That I bring up when when I have those feelings of that person's terrible, they're not doing their best. They're creating evil, they're creating suffering their creating harm and getting so angry with them. is how to come to some idea of this is what that really like more for me. What's helpful is getting curious about That person's truth and belief is that that is the most aligned action for them to take his that's action, they're taking. And the part of this that is a challenge for me is Holding on to it, still allowing myself to feel anger. I'm not like and acknowledging the anger that
Annie Altman (13:45): Yes. I, I want what, like, I'm thinking of like, what are euphemism of like buy and do that Buddhist philosophy of? Absolutely, because we're human. We are Going to make mistakes and fall. We're going to get attachments and things. Okay, I mean human suffering will thank you for that. Human suffering will exist as long
Annie Altman (18:00): attached to our label on that Spectrum. Absolutely. That makes me think a lot about reducer and the my experience is with vegetarianism and veganism. And Where I am now of the philosophy and like doing the zero waste experiments. Like I went in and the philosophy of, if you're, if I'm going to promote anything which is, if I'm gonna encourage any Behavior myself, it's reducer and as um, which is some sort of for, you know, accepting for myself. And for different people that it reduce your, if you're able to, if you have the financial the time, the all of the means to not support any factory farming, please do that. If you don't, then don't do that. If you have the means to make your own food and not use, you know, reduce your plastic use, do that like it's It to me is a way of having a more compassionate perspective for myself first so that I can have a more compassionate perspective for other people. The other thing that popped up we were talking was about because for me is and to come back again to that holding a bullet. I also tangible metaphors and just tangible physical. Things are really helpful for me. Helpful. and I thought about inflammation, maybe that was what that was reminding me of and how some inflammation is necessary for growth. If you, if you don't have any inflammation in your muscles in your system, you know, if you're never There are. Consequences that are. I'll call them unwanted or you know not what you would expect or intend for like hyper pure never like think about you know, weightlifting you're breaking muscles down to build muscle up. your child or wrong and get sore and then you have more muscles because of that inflammation So having some inflammation and having some evil, some good quote and like this is then again, the so to go to, you know, there is no good and evil, there is no right and wrong. Then what is best even mean of everyone is doing their, like, really what we could like everyone is doing is our topic like everyone is human, they're doing their human, they're, they're doing what they Feel is most aligned. I'm going to come to that word again. With with them.
Annie Altman (21:26): Like, and for you, I love you bringing this up. It's so this reminds me of to again, give a tangible reflection of My journey with food and learning about. She's the label of intuitive. Eating learning to do that and Something that came up for me and that comes up. So commonly as wait. If I give myself full permission to not have rules to not have set rigid, huge boundaries of right and wrong. Then won't I just not have a control won't like if you like in what you're saying if you give yourself you let yourself off the hook and say that you're always doing your best or you just gonna stop going to auditions and doing our bond and doing all of your things. And I'd be curious because I'm guessing logically, you know, that's not the case.
Annie Altman (23:11): Rick and Morty. Quote, that that's essentially like no one should be a parent because parents are just passing on their bulshit that they got from their parents. They got from their parents, they got from their parents and the cycle of her people hurting people. Which if you know, I'm I am open. Oh, Well, so I'm open to for like a little stroll down the nihilistic path there. That's like, okay, well then nothing matters. Essentially is where that goes, like, it's fun for a little bit to entertain that. And then where I come to is that I'm a lot happier when I choose to believe that
Annie Altman (23:56): And that from that route, you just brought up of babies when you when a baby is first born. When you see, two little kids playing in the sandbox, like, there's definitely you can see in children and perhaps this is where in the Miracle of Life. 🟡Really is like a continued thing. Because interacting with just witnessing small, humans, human being really can restore in the same way.🟡 I think, like, with puppies and kittens having cat. 🟡Here, it helps me. Restore a lot of faith in just the nature of Consciousness as quote, good, which is a weird thing to say with.🟡 Also, there is no good and bad. A two equate it with, with love to go and to that hippie lingo that I resist and use to say that, that is the case and that then because of things that have happened that then perpetuate more things happening. People all the cliches, if you get older and you get jaded and you get angry and you put more hurt out there and to go again, to shame being in effective. I I have a really challenging time seeing a world. That. Moves towards less suffering by being shameful to people about, you're doing terribly do better. And To me, I think of positive reinforcement and how all species, respond more effectively and more sustainably to that. And how much of it like to come back to your your point of That trust that if you give positive reinforcement, that you're not just going to plateau and stay where you are and that you're going to want to do more and want to keep going. And
Annie Altman (30:56): that I mean I'm thinking too about that, that's the That is a big belief. I have behind this whole project I'm doing and part of what I'm realizing is. I'm doing that project to reinforce that belief in me. It's my way of proving it to myself and also of being like well I can accept and I'm open to saying we're here just for funzies because it's like really possible that it's just organized chaos and not even organized chaos and we I do believe we don't know what we're doing and all of that. for me having that some point having a dristy point having a thing to look towards like hey there is the opportunity for us to feed all humans and then we could see what would happen from there because everyone's basic need for food would be met and think about what people could create with, with those up, with that opportunity to be a fucking human and and that is That is what gets me moving and motivated and out and what's interesting for me because like that I definitely resonate with that like well why then are we doing any of this? Or why are we here and that that 🟡voice🟡 of depression for me of Essentially like, fuck everything. There's also for me a 🟡different voice🟡 that 🟡comes up🟡 with the connection part of. Which again is why I'm doing this podcast and why I've created these projects, I'm realizing one episode more and more at a time. is the trusting of other people and the connecting and the showing up. Saying, hey, I don't know what I'm doing. I'm just doing my best. and hey, you Please show up and I'm going to trust you're doing your best too and I'm gonna trust that our best together is going to be a lot better than our best individually. Oh, now I'm feeling real mushy too cancer season. I mean, I was talking to you the other day.
Annie Altman (35:09): Yeah. That's why it's such a cluster fuk with all these different Loops in it. So messy, I was also seeing that interaction potentially as the part of the loop where you're upside down and backwards and you're like, what the fuck is going on here? And actually, She's giving you a gift of clarity about. Not only what, you don't feel good around. Also that you're allowed to have boundaries and I wonder too, if that's a big part of everyone, doing their best and I'm like, oh I'm just gonna let myself off the hook and I'm not gonna have any boundaries with myself or with anyone and it can, it can be both, you can have You can still choose. To not spend time with someone just to not spend time with them. So that sounds like that'll be one of your and that kind of already was going into this one of your takeaways from from this conversation from the topic.
Annie Altman (37:45): Oh yes, tension relief. So do your best and then fall out of the yoga pose and then do it again. And then one of the youngest That's my takeaway of this is best can evolve. failing can involve not knowing can involve messiness,
Annie Altman (39:37): we can do is to our best to figure out when that time is and when it isn't. When when do you need to put your energy into you and when is it most effective for you and most, you know, in the way that you believe is not creating harm To. To do that. And so then this is coming, you know, like maybe create that little moment of harm and saying something or that tension? for release and Only you can know what what and also like it doesn't. You know, it's not a serious as it feels sometimes, right? Like we don't know what we're doing. Like you just make the best decision at the time and

July 9, 2019: Annie publishes the 36th episode of her podcast: 36. Emotions are information with Lauren Traitz

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Annie Altman (1:40): To be analyzed. So we are talking about emotions in the information that they provide to us. Thank you so much for coming on. Lauren, I'm so glad. It's so nice to have
Annie Altman (4:53): than just getting dogmatically attached to one, this is how I make a truth of everything and this is how I live my life.
Annie Altman (11:34): this is a two exactly. This is this two-person conversation about emotions as information and, and what's really great that? I'm just realizing now in my own emotional information is that you being someone who I, I know, so, well already. Feels like such an amazing gift for this topic for me personally, to have someone who, I know values that I think brain that I have. And can give that part of, you know, put my ego, my pocket and, and you'll give that sciency part a little pile in the back. I see you Annie, you love thinking and you're someone who also, I feel that safety with, and someone who gives just as much Space, weight, validation, whatever, word to I feel statements and so getting to do this with you, I feel thank you. I'm really grateful.
Annie Altman (21:50): emotions are what i is emotions are what feels spiritual to me. which is a kind of, as I say, that sentence out loud and recording, it's a, that's a goofy feeling or what feel to me,
Annie Altman (22:06): they are and they are and they are The existence of them is what? And the experience, the experience of their existence for me, was what shifted my framework of truth from being so rigidly science? Math-based. Yes, and no base. To. The space for the, all of the gray area for emotions and something that I really enjoy with that. And that I still love exploring is the connection between emotions in our body and where their body and what happens physiologically like you were, you know, giving examples of physiological things that happen with certain emotions
Annie Altman (22:54): that lead to certain things. And one thing that is coming into my Consciousness, now, is this idea of Consciousness originating of their not being proof that Consciousness originates in the brain?
Annie Altman (23:08): that's how we talk about it, often. That's our framework that Consciousness is in the whole body that it's felt that it is
Annie Altman (31:28): yeah, that resonates deeply because of how much I believe fear is about unknown that Putting those labels together, a fear and unknown and touching against that. And then that sparking that like touching the hot stove and you're like that's that is that feeling coming up and and moral, right? Like
Annie Altman (31:55): Totally in the fact that the fear is, there isn't a lean in or lean out the other. So for me, As the, the physical. Feeling and existence really is. my my a big part of my belief in this topic and in this truth and What? One of the things I was reflecting on is the similar things that happen in our bodies with fear and excitement,
Annie Altman (32:25): how that whole leaning into fear in your Scared, because you're coming into a new Part of Yourself. What you're so excited for and your heart rate goes up when you're scared. And when you're excited, you can get sweaty. You can have racing thoughts. They can have really similar physical responses
Annie Altman (32:48): good stuff. I just, I'm so excited the stuff of life and and we can again not like you were saying, not being more realistic about, What that is I guess I'm realizing as I'm saying that, that's part of my confusion that comes up with emotions is information and me wanting to have such set answers of what the things are. Let me
Annie Altman (33:16): you're speaking exactly what. There's definitely a part of me that once and also there's a bigger part of me that's like, fuck that. Because then that's in boxes of things. it just it changes the game of this life thing because then It rather than it being like, Oh, I have this physiological symptoms. So it means this emotion, it's like, I have this physiological symptoms. So it could mean these 12.
Annie Altman (36:56): love you bringing up the emotions unifying us because we all feel them and you bringing up that your anger in my anger are different and my son or different. and the part that I come to in this is my Spiritual belief of this in terms of emotions as our connection to our soul to the collective emotional. Everyone feels angry. Everyone feels sadness. Everyone. Everyone is had that poops. It's like Evolution and yeah, and everything is comes down to. If you don't get to be in a not poop, right? Like, you don't
Annie Altman (37:53): lifelong work at trying to figure out what this means for you. Information's gonna keep coming in all shift it, but
Annie Altman (40:18): into something. And yeah, and there's, this podcast is one way of doing that. So when journaling, someone running doing yoga doing paint, whatever your thing is, take your self out for coffee, do the something that because life is gonna keep changing because the emotions are gonna keep changing. One of my favorite metaphors is emotions. Are like the whether they're going to keep going.
Annie Altman (40:40): do do something for, for the space for them. Because one thing that keeps coming up for me in this and one of my emotional lessons to continually get to learn and unpack in different ways, is The emotion of Judgment of Shame of piling on this other layer. On top of any, any feeling that essentially says, some version of this feeling can't be here. Mmm, it's so counterproductive because that it just takes away, attention, for that feeling, that just once tension and would be quote dealt with much more easily. If given it's like a,
Annie Altman (42:32): that actually reminds me of something, my dad would joke about and I love when you talk about that part of contact and loss, and Connection and something, I've reflected on a lot in grieving. My dad is the the part that keeps coming up and will continue to come up of Honestly what sucks the most is that I don't get to hear him talk about his life and my life and what's going on. I don't get to hear, you know, as much like I could go into any spiritual whatever. If he sees it, he's here, he's listening right now. I don't get a hear him, damn it. And that's that, that part of it and that connection point and something, he said, on something you were just saying about with addiction. Was he was certain shoes because he said his toes all the time. So we were like shoes with big toe like thing over. So he didn't like very dad shoes which was great to prevent this issue. In the event that he did, step his toe, or something happened, or, like some injury at Joe. Cute. Often make is be like, bite my finger. Like here, let me bite your finger, so that then you distract from that other pain, exactly what you're just saying with with the addiction and or anxiety Loops or shame,
Annie Altman (46:30): guilt. Guilt of, I did something bad. And shame, I am bad.
Annie Altman (48:07): Yes, I love a kid because I was thinking, even internal family system. Shout out to Sunny, teaching me about. And you know, one about I know
- Note: see Internal Family Systems Model - Wikipedia
Annie Altman (48:24): 🟡All the IFS. Shout outs and that he concept of tending to all your parts. All your emotional parts of having space. For all of them like, Child and like you would with, with giving that space, I loved that you use the word gifs. And I was reflecting on our title of emotions or information, emotions or gifts. It's a gift to get that communication. It's a gift towards your Consciousness for your connection.🟡
Annie Altman (53:21): up your perspective that makes me think too of the, how you do anything is how you do everything and to bring it to emotions. It's such a good quote and it just came up for me again this morning. And With emotions, as information. If you're excluding, any of your emotions. Then that's going to lead to exclusionary behavior in communities and in other things, and that's part of a big part of the tolerate in another's. No. No. And you'll bring that out another's more. You'll create whole communities and Frameworks, that put that up on a pedestal. And that's a big part of my intention here is, it's like the Maslow's pyramid and you started the bottom and you build. So if you started hey we're all humans. We all have feelings, any of us, excluding our feelings harm, any of us because then people do violent shit. Yes. And sufferings gonna happen and we can also definitely do things to minimize it.
Annie Altman (57:21): emotional information just gives us more beautiful material to create Beauty and things that feel beautiful to do. Yeah that's I think the emotional part I'm coming to as well like the difference between the expression of the yoga pose versus the feeling of it and coming to that and What else are we doing? But feel and feelings. You
Annie Altman (57:46): That's so. And I like that's all sorts of rooted in privilege to be like, okay, well you have like very lots of things to do and also, regardless of what you're doing, feelings are going to come up and I feel that part of what, I'm what I believe in using using privileged to equitably distribute resources that have led to this hierarchical system of privilege. Where Having space to be with your emotions as a right.
Annie Altman (1:01:24): looks like, you know, we're all like oh sharing oxygen molecules in this In This Very Room and I love that you. I love you bringing that up because something I was thinking about two in the previous. Part, you were saying about. Connection and about how beautiful that is in in human connection and that repair and that focus on repair. When you were bringing up, those reactive moments. That have what said, hug me up those reactive moments that come up That then lead to some big reactive, violent action. We repair those with other people because someone else comes in friend, family trained therapist, whatever that person is that comes and holds the space for your emotions and for that emotion and that's how we go anywhere. As a whole group, someone has to hold the space eventually. So it really does make sense for you to do. Your best Annie to hold? Hold them yourself. So, yeah, I mean, yeah, and also ask for help for holding them because it's no one can hold all their things on there. So, all
Annie Altman (1:07:07): that to me is especially where for my anger coming out of like, what the fuck are we doing? Collectively humans. Yeah, prioritize the distribution of so much other stuff and we're not prioritizing distribution of basic needs. We're not prioritizing stopping trafficking doing things
Annie Altman (1:07:42): and to change anything. I love this. This is my, this is my main takeaway for this topic with you is, is this of that validation of emotions? Not 100% is truth valid, truth all the time. And not just a wolf. Yeah, they're valid because they exist Annie that because they have a purpose. They have a purpose, So that's my walking away, what are, what will you be walking away from from this? Many things it'll stick with you or something. You would want someone to walk away from listening to this with

In ~summer 2019, about a year after the death of her Dad (Jerry), Annie is notified about being the primary beneficiary of her Dad's 401K [AA23m, AA24a, AA24b].

In light of these situational factors, Annie makes a plan to quit her job for 6 months [AA--c] to focus on her health, expecting that she'd receive money that Jerry had left for her, which would cover her financial needs during that time. She notifies her relatives -- specifically: Connie, Sam, Jack, and Max [AA23m] -- that she is sick [AA18b], and informs them of her plan [AA24b, AA23k, AA23m, AA24a].

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From [AA20b], which Annie posted May 19, 2020:
- "This time a year ago, I gave notice to leave a job I enjoyed because of being in paperwork-process of money left to me from my dad that I was notified of a year after he died. I decided to use this privilege."
- "I openly shared about my plan to use the next six months to finish writing a script that was and is extremely important to me, to give more time to the podcast and other other projects, and mostly to give myself more time both to grieve..."
- "...and to manage my physical and emotional health that needed attention."
- "Despite their already enormous wealth, the rest of my immediate biological relatives choose to use the option they were then given to override my dad’s wishes and withhold the money."

In the summer of 2019, Annie carries out her plan as intended, and quits her job at a dispensary [AA24b]. Annie quits her job while in the middle of a process of completing paperwork that she had to complete to receive the money. That is, she hadn't yet received the 401K money when she quit her job, but was expecting to receive it soon {once the paperwork was completed.} [AA23r]

However, after quitting her job, while in process of completing the rest of the necessary paperwork to receive the money that Jerry left to her in his 401K, Annie discovers, to her surprise, that the money Jerry left for her in his 401K is going to be withheld until Annie {currently ~25} is in her 60's [AA23m].

It turns out that her mother Connie used, as Annie describes it, a "legal loophole" [AA23k] of sorts to override Jerry's wishes and block Annie from receiving the 401K funds Jerry had left to her [AA24b, AA23k, AA23m, AA23r].

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In [AA23m], Annie writes, "Though separated, my parents were still legally married and so my mother had the “surviving spouse” option to ignore Dad’s wish to make me the primary beneficiary of his 401K."
In [AA23b], Annie writes, "Aww you’re nervous I’m defending myself? Refusing to die with your secrets, refusing to allow you to harm more people? If only there was little sister with a bed you could uninvited crawl in, or sick 20-something sister you could withhold your dead dad’s money from, to cope."

Thus, Annie ends up with a set of serious health issues that make it hard for her to stand and hard to work, and also unemployed and low on money.

Finding herself in an increasingly-desperate financial situation, Annie starts selling some of her possessions (furniture [BB24d] and clothes [AA24b]) for money. Eventually, for the first time in her life, Annie asks her mother Connie for financial help. Connie refuses to provide help [BB24d]. Annie then asks Sam for financial help; he was "told to say no because of her {Connie} wanting him to say no." [BB24d] See also: [AA23k, EW23a]

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"She {Annie} quit her job at a dispensary because she had an injured Achilles tendon that wouldn’t heal and she was in a walking boot for the third time in seven years. She asked Sam and their mother for financial help. They refused. “That was right when I got on the sugar-dating website for the first time,” Annie told me. “I was just at such a loss, in such a state of desperation, such a state of confusion and grief.” Sam had been her favorite brother. He’d read her books at bedtime. He’d taken portraits of her on the monkey bars for a high-school project. She’d felt so understood, loved, and proud. “I was like, Why? Why are these people not helping me when they could at no real cost to themselves?”"" [EW23a]

July 23, 2019: Annie publishes the 38th episode of her podcast: 38. There is a greater good with Tom Degnan

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➡️ Annie Altman (7:36): Absolutely. Thank you for bringing that up the sea that the sea that connects the 10 C's of the humanity connection. All we got and I shared before we recording that this this topic feels a bit vulnerable for me because it really feels like not like it feels like tapping in to such a core of that project, which is reminding myself and others that this greater good exists. That that darkness is there and that we can all move towards goodness towards towards the light, so to speak. Even if it is just for the mental sanity of having a drifty point to move towards
➡️ Annie Altman (32:11): Well and with this really about them as a person and saying cool that you act cool that you do this. What do you think? What do you feel about it? And that to me is the fear that comes up for me on every recording and and for for most guests it seems for for all I want to say all guests of its vulnerable to to put out that it's almost like it's an unpopular and uncool opinion to say, I believe humans are good. I believe. Humans are net good. I believe that the world is not good. That there is a greater good. Maybe because it's tied to religious things. Like do you feel like there's this religious connotation that comes up or like astrology and crystals or shifting that now and people are like, oh spirituality is different. Well,
➡️ Annie Altman (33:58): And then, that is a human nature aside from I guess. So my head goes to It's been a process for me, of letting go of feeling a lot of anger towards organized religion for all of the negative things that has done and remembering that it's also done a lot of positive things. And I wonder how much Religion is. Or at least. part of religion are reflections of the goodness of human, that that human nature that is there regardless of any Decree or text or or whatever. That is just innately in. Two toddlers who are out in a park and one toddler sees that the other toddler doesn't have food and they have food and they're like, here you go. Other human that all needs this exact same thing that I need. It's
Tom Degnan (34:49): a beautiful moment or when you see, you know,
➡️ Annie Altman (34:51): that it's just there.
Tom Degnan (34:52): It's well it is and if you think about it, children at that age, there is no preconceived notion of the world because they've whatever they've seen like they don't, they they don't necessarily have a skewed view of anything yet and so I think that's what makes it like a very beautiful moment.
➡️ Annie Altman (35:08): and so is religion, then coming in I guess it almost feels to me like, in some ways, religion, corrupted for lack of a better word or a stronger word. this idea of greater good, which I'm realizing is part of my That part of me that feels uncomfortable to really claim. As my truth, there's a greater good and shout it from the rooftops to me comes from that organized religion connection and I'm like, oh, but but the Orthodox Jews, I've come across, but the Orthodox, whatever I've come across, like,
➡️ Annie Altman (37:28): Reminding ourselves and others reminding others to remind ourselves. The advice we give to others is the advice that we're giving to ourselves. That there is a greater good memory, just that awareness that it exists.
➡️ Annie Altman (38:15): what your what you're taking away, what you're going to walk away when we turn off microphones and take off the headphones, what you're walking away with and perhaps something. You you feel like someone listening could walk away with as well. And I'll go first, like I said so for me Remembering. Just the there is a greater good that awareness, that that exists. is a very helpful tool for me for trusting because in moments of Being Human and lacking trust in other people and myself in situations in whatever the thing is, I'm gonna experiment with reminding myself. That there is that I can trust that there is a greater good. So I can't trust all these other things. Maybe right now I can trust that there's a greater good and that's enough.

July 30, 2019: Annie publishes the 39th episode of her podcast: 39. Practice non-attachment to prioritize contentment with Stephanie Copperman

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➡️ Annie Altman (2:26): the feeling exists. Yeah. Whoa. Cool. That's a very cool affection. So for how do you come to understand? Your truth is is a big part of that checking in in your body of. Okay this feelings come up is this in my chest and my gut
➡️ Annie Altman (9:32): Something you shared two before recording was about sort of playing therapist, two people who were shopping at high-end retail stores. And so it's interesting to me that you, you're still using that skillset in teaching yoga. In a different way. It is still an offering of of therapy in a sense and all your yoga teachers. Also not your therapist totally. So it, it's an interesting seeing you still sort of doing that in a way that that feels a lot more tangible. Yeah. On a day-to-day basis and I was, I was also reflecting on space and how the practice of yoga and making space and space for breath and making space for happiness. So not attaching to being so happy all the time. It's all sunshine and rainbows. I'm so just like Zen and in my third eye forever like, right? It making space, I am allowing space for for happiness to be there. That, you know, I'm going to go along my journey and I'll meet up with happiness. Perhaps, I'll find it and I'll see it. I'll notice it. As I come across it in and out,
➡️ Annie Altman (11:31): Yeah, it's a very different. The dealing getting a material thing and it's it's with improving language the yes and of capitalism and consumers and and with the humanity in this idea that capitalism needs to get out of Health Care and needs to get out of Education, it needs to get out of Rehabilitation and all. So Capitalism can stay in other places and we can do it in more mindful ways. If someone wants to have some really expensive shoes or handbags to me, having some of those things is so different from having a whole closet full of them, just in terms of numerically like the number of dollars and as that keeps compounding and just getting bigger and bigger, the more stuff that you have to me. Well it's not a black and white line. There is some line, there's some cut off where it's like this fucking Ludacris like these dollars need to be going to people who don't have their basic needs, right? Because those shoes are literally saying your fucking closet, right?
➡️ Annie Altman (16:36): Yeah, it sounds like that. It was a conscious choice of hey I see you fear. I feel you and I'm still choosing to prioritize. How it feels for me to teach yoga versus how it feels for me to sell things to people. Yes. And and focus on that. And in my experience of letting go of going to medical school, after doing the classes for that, and working in that in science labs and deciding not to do that. I, I really resonate with that. both having the fear of changing paths, and Having that knowing that truth, that authenticity, that you gave an end to come back to your first. The first question, your first answer about where the feeling is of following that, That's sort of lightness and in your in my chest that excitement. Yeah. like
➡️ Annie Altman (26:20): and that perspective as a way to really be extra grateful and really enjoy your time together because Because it's finite because our lives are finite and as much as it can get. So existential as humans, like, coming out, we're gonna die. It's all so, wow, what a great way to really remind us how valuable our time is. And the time that we get with people is and how important connection is because what else are we doing
Stephanie Copperman (26:45): here? Totally? Yeah. Yeah, you don't think anything for granted. You shouldn't take anything for granted.
➡️ Annie Altman (26:53): Yeah. Well Yes. And how does that? How does that fit in with? With non-attachment because as you reflected to me, which I agree with, I'm a very passionate person. I, I feel things very intensely and I I do feel a lot of gratitude for things and I I wonder sometimes how then maybe that can be its own form of attachment or its own like you're attachment to. Let's just like, if it's, I'm giving so many books about something if I'm giving so much emotional energy towards something, Feeling like oh like it. What point does this become an attachment because Because of, in priorities because it's, it's taking up so much space in my priorities. And I say, all of this, with the other part of something, I am a mantra that I love, which is that attachment to non-attachment is still attachment. Yeah. As someone who has lived as an extremist in my life and like needs to sort of not, sort of needs to touch the walls of boundaries of things. That. Yeah. It's it's It's just kind of the the Paradox to me of how do I prioritize contentment and also not get attached to happiness. Like we've been saying,
➡️ Annie Altman (28:56): yeah. Is that sort of how you view? Attachment like that closed hand grip of attaching. It is then like you're kind of like sucked into a certain. Yeah, I think so or like, yeah, the clothes hanger, like the
➡️ Annie Altman (32:05): helpful. How much of non-attachment? Do you feel believe comes to trust? And that yoga, you know, trust the process which I say sarcastically to say it until, I mean, it of trusting, not attaching to control to trust that. The outcome. It depends and it will be what it will be a
➡️ Annie Altman (33:08): to allow yourself to prioritize to allow yourself to prioritize, contentment and to trust That that's okay. I love that you brought that up with relationships as well and and trusting, and yeah, that that letting go of 🟡I don't know what will happen🟡 and that can be great and that can be that that can, it doesn't have to be this. 🟡this scary thing, this whatever🟡, this yeah, it it's it's interesting too to me when, when you said About again, that sort of where my feeling this feeling and where trust where I feel trust in my body and what you brought up about, like sort of, you know, do I feel this in my chest or something I had wonderful to me about like 🟡feeling it in your kidneys, essentially your low back that's sort of fight or flight🟡. and, What Trust? Where in the body trust comes in,
➡️ Annie Altman (41:07): Yeah. So hello. Yeah. At least at least said hello. Yeah. Yeah. That I definitely find that the more resistance, I have more resistance that comes up against something, the more, the more curiosity, see to put into that thing of, wait, why, why am I so attached to specifically be like I could never let that thing go, right?...Yeah. And that, that quote, everything you want is on the other side of fear. Love that. The more you let go of that. That whatever thing is that Is not contributing, helpfully to your contentment. The more space you have for something else to come in. Exactly. I think that's that's usually the case too, right? It's like
➡️ Annie Altman (42:42): I I'm really glad that we, we ended up going with this topic because I was challenged about how to combine these things. And I was like, this is so much content. This is so much stuff to talk about, not attachment and contentment and and bridging that gap between them and your patience with it and and generally helping with These are directly connected. These practices go, go hand-in-hand with each other. so, so thank you for that to me, is my my takeaway from from this episode is seeing the connection not attachment seen connection between Non-attachment. And Choosing to prioritize my, my contentment. Right? And yeah, and remembering that as a tool on my tool belt of things, much, like yoga and other, all of the other things that I can can do towards my contentment, that Non-attachment is. Maybe kind of a piece of all of those tools. Yeah, I think so. Not even like not attaching to one specific tool. Okay. There's my takeaway really is that reminder of Because something I come to with any tools, be it, you know, yoga or pot or therapy, or any of these things that I'm doing, is that the same thing with like astrology, dogma of, if you're making all your decisions, based on one thing, I'm always going back to one same tool than I'm probably attached to that tool, right? And is that really serving my contentment?
Stephanie Copperman (44:24): Probably not long term. Probably not long term. Yeah. I mean,
➡️ Annie Altman (44:29): like, don't get me wrong, spliffs, can be great, sometimes,
Stephanie Copperman (44:31): agreed.
➡️ Annie Altman (44:33): And what is my long-term, like, is this, the only thing I'm doing to self-soothe like that is gonna bite me in the butt at some point?
Stephanie Copperman (44:43): Hi, but it's not, you know, you have other in, you know, you have other things that make you happy, you know, you're not just rolling Swiss. I mean maybe why? But like you're also going to yoga, you're making podcasts. You're in your kitchen. Dehydrating, amazing cookies, making of like there's other things, not just one, you know? Yeah. And you're not. So then therefore I think that shows you that you're not. You know, 150% attacked to this one thing. Totally. Yeah, zooming out and remembering.
➡️ Annie Altman (45:17): Well, thank you, I will. I will remember. I will not attach and hold the contentment of that reflection of zooming out of all of the different things. What, what? Something that you'll walk out of here with something that. or something that, you know, for someone listening, you feel like in addition to the podcast challenge, they can walk away with
Stephanie Copperman (47:02): suffering teaches you things like there's so much to that, you know, you learn so much from from Pain and from totally you know it's such a great. It is a tool and it's something that should never not be a part of your life.
➡️ Annie Altman (47:16): Totally attaching to avoiding pain. Yeah. You end up missing out on a lot of learning. Yeah.
Stephanie Copperman (47:20): Yeah. So it never should be about that. Like the goal should never be like to be the happiest person you could ever be and not have pain or struggle or anything like that.
➡️ Annie Altman (47:29): That's not realistic. It's never yeah.
Stephanie Copperman (47:33): Actually it's not realistic. yeah, she's never be about that, but but yeah, that it It doesn't happen. Yeah, it doesn't have to all be. So bad, so
➡️ Annie Altman (47:46): sad. Good can be happy to give me happy
Stephanie Copperman (47:50): too. It's just a choice. Yeah. So many warm,
➡️ Annie Altman (47:54): fuzzies
Stephanie Copperman (47:55): fuzzy,
➡️ Annie Altman (47:55): 21 fuzzies. You're allowed to be happy. You're allowed to be happy. Yeah, it helps other people for you to be happy. If that's what we're getting all caught up in and in my mid-twenties part of the people pleasing. And yeah, my happiness is helpful to other people and so is yours. Yes. Yes, thank you for coming and sharing. Thank you so much.

August 6, 2019: Annie publishes the 40th episode of her podcast: 40. Compassion begins with you (right now) with Deacon Conroy

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Speaker 2 (2:41): yeah, I mean that's like there's I use the point of, you know, astrology it's like, a fact or not, it doesn't matter if there's truth in it, if you learn something about it, if it's something speaks to you some way, great, at the same thing with yoga at the same thing with You know, Catholicism, it's anything. It's like It doesn't have to be fact and neat, like it's a needs to be truth, you know? Because it has to give you, meaning fact, just proves something. It's just, yep. That is the sky is blue type things. but truth, it's How does that feel, you know, how does that? What is the sky feel like to you?
➡️ Annie Altman (3:23): oh, I'm so I'm I'm really grateful for this answer because this is a helpful encapsulation of why I have this resistance about this podcast and this topic, and having something about compassion and compassion for myself of this fluidity with the the part in me, At least that wants to attach to prove it that truth that I this podcast used to be called true shit. And this what is truth, and proving truth and and talking about truth, when, well, what if truth is fluid
➡️ Annie Altman (4:56): Very interesting. So how how do you come to Understand your truth. You feel your feelings. You what is, what is that? What is the What is understanding fluidity?
➡️ Annie Altman (14:44): Because you really took the time to pause and reflect on it. I wonder if that is and buy a Wandering. I mean that's definitely my resistance of this podcast. Topic is the pause to listen to myself. And and also in what you're saying about the practice, what you practiced the, the insecurity in me that comes up of Talking about listening to yourself and that I do believe that that is important to do and compassionate to do and helpful for everyone for anyone to do. 🟡And the part of me that comes up that says, well you don't listen to yourself very well or that is mean to myself of Judge, you know, saying that story of not doing that or🟡
Deacon Conroy (15:26): we'll make friends with that voice. Totally make friends with the thing that like, talks down to you you know oh you know you shouldn't but whatever voice that says that make friends with that voice and really investigate it because that's The reaction to. The desire you have that's the reaction to the thought. You know, there's some emotion that arise is in the thought that pops in. You shouldn't do that and it's like Work backwards. Find out take a pause. Find out where that comes from.
➡️ Annie Altman (15:58): Totally,
Deacon Conroy (15:59): that's not your voice. That's someone else's voice.
➡️ Annie Altman (16:02): It is, 🟡it's not my voice.🟡 It's not my voice and sitting with it is where the pause comes up, and the space of literal space to be like to be curious. to ramble around in a podcast, in a therapy and a yoga class, you know, whatever and Say hey voice, I hear you. I'm gonna listen to you.
➡️ Annie Altman (16:52): That's why I do feel comfortable in this as a true shit, thesis topic of this fluid truth. Moment that I know what has to start here, because this is the only starting place I have.
Deacon Conroy (17:04): And
➡️ Annie Altman (17:05): a little bit of we are discussing with the cognitive dissonance of you, and who is you anyways, and, and that I Feel So within my personal experience again, that resistance of listening to myself, is that it really means having more space for will whom I listening to Who Am I, who am I into this microphone right now in this podcast, feeling meta, feeling insecure about sounding Stone rambly. All of these things of Walking on wobbly legs towards a more compassionate self.
Deacon Conroy (17:40): And that voice is always there, you know, it's like,
➡️ Annie Altman (17:43): is that the ego voice? What is that? Who is that?
Deacon Conroy (17:47): yeah, I mean I think that's the ego it's like Alan Watts as a thing where the ego is like a sonar on a submarine. It's constantly scanning for danger. And, you know, it's like just finding all the rocks and everything and in its way. And after a while, that's how we associate life. So we're like in a constant state of anxiety because we're constantly looking for danger. But the flip side of that is, you don't realize that there's a whole ocean of, you know, of world around you. You're just like this. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. So yeah, when I heard that I was like oh there's you can kind of disassociate with that voice a little bit but it's there. It's you know, that Voice pops up when you're driving it pops up. When you're, you know what I'm teaching? Sometimes it's, you know, in class today I'm like, oh, this is shit, everyone hates. This is going. That's like, That's but that's just a thought, right? And that's just like your core thought of that. Is inside is a weird way. It's trying to protect you from getting hurt but it's it becomes your, it becomes our Way of doing anything, you know?
➡️ Annie Altman (18:56): Remembering that. I'm glad you brought up the part about protection because that framing is a way that I found to be really helpful to be more compassionate towards that voice and the different flavors of it of Getting curious again about its intention and
➡️ Annie Altman (23:03): You know. Okay, so how do I apply that to the part of me? Less recently with spliffs and more mobiles? How do I apply that to that?
Deacon Conroy (23:11): Or what?
➡️ Annie Altman (23:12): How do I apply that to 🟡the part of me that that likes tobacco mixed with weed🟡 that. So cigarettes, don't to call me.
Deacon Conroy (23:21): Yeah.
➡️ Annie Altman (23:21): And spliffs don't currently.
Deacon Conroy (23:24): Yeah, and
➡️ Annie Altman (23:25): I have and, and I've been
Deacon Conroy (23:27): spliff is like a, yeah, 50 50 right?
➡️ Annie Altman (23:30): right? Yeah. Yeah. So join is just weed. Yeah. If you're in Europe, and someone says joint often, they mean spliff joined as a very American thing to have pure weed and is it's it is and I do notice a difference in how it feels and I guess so like what you were just describing. I was putting myself in your shoes when you were saying that story about imagining like, that doesn't sound good to me to smoke. Even a whole one whole cigarette is not appealing.
Deacon Conroy (23:59): Well, yeah, and
➡️ Annie Altman (23:59): so then in some ways it's like I can use that to justify smoking any tobacco more. Its the same bullshit.
Deacon Conroy (24:04): Well yeah, like cigarettes are bulshit cigarettes are fucking disgusting, you know, like even American Spirits, they're fucking gross. You know, cigarettes are gross fucking things and I know because I smoked them for 15 years, but I mean what you're doing, like if you're taking a little tobacco and like here and there, and throwing it in, its like, You feel like you live in Los Angeles, think about all the shity things, you're breathing and every day, the air quality in the city is fucking terrible. Think about all the brake dust that's in the air like the dust that comes up every time you tap on your breaks as a fine dust that comes up. Like all the cars here. Look at the small and you're like having a like a little bit of tobacco here and there. Fuck it.
➡️ Annie Altman (24:51): Thank you. So that's a great reminder for me personally. Compassion. Begins with zooming out. for me personally and my tendency with the you Of this you speaking, as someone who is tendency has more to zoom super to zoom way in and attached to. I'm a bad person or like some story about being bad, not taking care of myself perfectly because of
Deacon Conroy (25:20): because that's a story because,
➡️ Annie Altman (25:22): yeah, when in reality and I guess I hadn't had it reflected that clearly because I have thought of like pollution here and all these other things and it is also Yeah. Just the zooming out of whatever you're doing in the overall of what you're doing but
Deacon Conroy (25:37): you're having the tobacco and the voice in your head says you're a bad person so you don't have to take care of yourself.
➡️ Annie Altman (25:43): Yes which is more harmful than the tobacco,
Deacon Conroy (25:45): right? But you still do the thing. You still use the tobacco, but the voice is The resistance, right?
➡️ Annie Altman (25:54): Yes. And the voice changes and I've definitely like I've gone through lots of but I've got more periods without tobacco.
Deacon Conroy (26:02): I've concentrated on The Voice. Okay, whose voice is that?
➡️ Annie Altman (26:06): The voice of society at know. Well, sort of it's the it's the in the same kind of like. So we were talking about with weed and Reefer Madness and that programming,
Deacon Conroy (26:16): right? And
➡️ Annie Altman (26:16): that stuff, it is the voice of All science, as tobacco's, the worst thing ever for you and your and it's gonna kill you even though then there's the other part of like
Deacon Conroy (26:27): it's not about the tobacco, it's about the voice that says that thing. The voice that says, you're bad. You don't know how to take care of yourself.
➡️ Annie Altman (26:33): Yes,
Deacon Conroy (26:33): it's not about the tobacco. That's just the symptom of that voice and like but whose voice is that? Who made you feel like you were bad? And don't know how to take care of yourself?
➡️ Annie Altman (26:44): Are you looking for me to say did you like is this a specific person? Is this like relationship with a parent thing is this
Deacon Conroy (26:50): that's what mine was like my relationship. Okay? Like the like the story that I was stuck in was my relationship with myself and saying the same thing because I like I there was, there was a split in my Soul growing up where it's like I couldn't trust myself, I couldn't trust my emotion, I didn't express myself properly. So if there's a like shame that's like shame that comes down. So it's like, where does the shame come from?
➡️ Annie Altman (27:14): You know. Yes, fuck it. So this is more therapy than I anticipated. It feels one like a cop out to point a finger and also them, 🟡it feels like, oh, I'm not allowed to🟡 or it's it's like pointing like if I were to say, like,
Deacon Conroy (27:35): why aren't you allowed to? I
➡️ Annie Altman (27:36): don't. 🟡I don't know🟡 because like because all well, also because it's so, Cliche and trite and all these things. And I guess that's why I'm doing this, is to remember that we all have this and so it is I'm allowed because of guilt because it feels like then saying that discounts any sort of positive thing. For like yeah, it doesn't. It's all bulshit. Thanks. You're like smiling. So chill. Like you're like that's a freaking
Deacon Conroy (28:07): like like this. But like this. This is it like this. Thank you. This is what happens? You know, scars happen. When we were young. And then they happen from usually by people that are older than us authority figures, and things like that. And we're too young to figure out what the fuk happened. So that's trauma. And that's how we kind of go about doing things, right,
➡️ Annie Altman (28:29): it's true. Okay, so it's
Deacon Conroy (28:31): like Go ahead. Sorry.
➡️ Annie Altman (28:32): My 🟠🟠the voice is my mom.🟠🟠 And my mom is a doctor and so She had the voice of and so did I of all of the medical community, says, tobacco's terrible for you and it's gonna kill you faster, and more painfully, and all of this, all of these things. And so, if you're doing this thing that, you know, is bad for you, then you're bad.🟡
Deacon Conroy (28:57): Why does Annie have to be bad? Why can't it just be something unhealthy that you do? Like it's like something you're doing that for you. That's bad and your bad.
➡️ Annie Altman (29:10): Yeah,
Deacon Conroy (29:10): that's the shame of the ends like and you're about. It's like you you are not bad. He just smoking some tobacco when you want to smoke some tobacco. Do you know better? Do you know like tobacco like
➡️ Annie Altman (29:19): do I know that it makes it harder for me to breathe? Then sure. Can we does sure. And yeah, this was like, so just going outside and walking around.
Deacon Conroy (29:28): Yeah, but it's like you're smoking weed.
➡️ Annie Altman (29:30): It's like it's still burning plant matter.
Deacon Conroy (29:32): Yeah, yeah. It's still like inhaling smoke and tar. So it's
➡️ Annie Altman (29:37): Maybe compassion begins with laughing. For me Humor is a great coping mechanism.
Deacon Conroy (29:42): Well, you kind of
➡️ Annie Altman (29:43): like passion because then it helps me like you're being fucking ridiculous. Like this is a great future stand up
Deacon Conroy (29:48): that's things. Like that's the thought that we attached to it. It's like when you start to realize what you're doing is like you kind of laughed because you're like, oh I'm just thinking this all the time it and it's not easy. It takes practice to not shame yourself all the time, you know. And some days you're good at some days, you're bad. But when you start to realize, it's like, oh, that's the thing. How you do, anything is how you do everything. It's like, oh, I'm shaming myself all the time. If I'm at a red light. Oh, I'm not going to get there on time. I'm going to be rushed. Everyone's Gonna Hate they yoga class, blah, blah, or At home making dinner. It's like, I'm just making this Frozen fucking stir-fry from Trader. Joe's because you're a loser and you know, don't have money to go out and stuff like like that's like the shame voice, right? It's like no one comes into the world shaming themselves.
➡️ Annie Altman (30:33): Totally.
Deacon Conroy (30:34): No one comes in the world feeling guilty. You know, it's like it's patterns that you learn specially shame, I don't know what guilt is not my thing. Not like it's like a fad. It's like no, I'm not into hot yoga, not on the guilt, not in the game, not in the guilt lately, maybe in Fall 2020,
➡️ Annie Altman (30:52): 🟡learning the difference. Between those of guilt being I did something bad and shame being. I am bad has been really, really helpful for me to to distinguish those.🟡
Deacon Conroy (31:01): Yeah, shame sucks. But it's like that, but it's like they're going back to it. It's like You know. Things. You can just happen. Like you're not bad because you spoke to back. Oh, you know, I'm not bad because I smoke weed, even though weed was so bad growing up, but there's still like a reaction around it. Like it's just insecure, it's just because it's The story I had was for like, 30 years, that weed was bad. and I know the story of the past three or four years and like, oh, When I start smoking, I started smoking at 37 on 40 now. So the past three years has just been like oh well yeah we it's okay, you know, talking to friends. Do you smoke weed
➡️ Annie Altman (31:41): too? Actually,
Deacon Conroy (31:43): I was like a child. I was like, I would ask people like how do I smoke weed? Do I need to get a pie? I mean, What's, you know,
➡️ Annie Altman (31:51): totally, I relate to that, that shame and guilt about weed as well and feeling. 🟡I guess what? I'm realizing for me is how much of it comes down to? Almost the Imposter syndrome of like something that is this indication that I am doing a subpar job of taking care of myself and like that's like you as a subpar human like. That is the shame of it for me and it's interesting.🟡 Like what you were saying was more? It was.
Deacon Conroy (32:21): What's the thought? That's driving you to that shame? Shame is a feeling because there's a thought.
➡️ Annie Altman (32:30): 🟡The general human. Not enoughness that I am not enough.🟡 In. Or the. To go back to pause and the space with compassion 🟡that. I'm supposed to exist in a more rigid box than I can actually exist in as a person,🟡
Deacon Conroy (32:50): but who's who's boxes is that? Whose rigid box are you trying to exist in?
➡️ Annie Altman (32:58): 🟡Well, I'm figuring out one day podcast at a time🟡 that I get to. The only boxes but I mean. Now. Okay, that one too. That's just me and just my body that I get to make.
Deacon Conroy (33:13): Hmm.
➡️ Annie Altman (33:13): Those rules those all of it that I am, the one, the captain of the ship for Of it. With this is so, okay. Well so this is interesting because this feels very much This feels very therapy, s in a way that to go back to your first answer of Truth being fluid. 🟡part of what has been a, an acceptance process for me in therapy is That there is a value in rambling and shooting the shit and not necessarily having a well what are we talking about? And what are my notes? And what is our bullet? And how are we going to ground this with meta things and reality and blah blah, and that there can be value in? The journey, the process. Yeah. I don't know if that has been a theme you have experienced in therapy or in yoga The trust the process of🟡
➡️ Annie Altman (35:11): 🟡I'm sitting with all the different voices that come up that are part of you.🟡 All
Deacon Conroy (35:15): the different voice is
➡️ Annie Altman (35:16): 🟡Internal family systems, shout out. And my many other practices.🟡 How has that? So coming in to you know, going through different phases of your life and you had some experience as an actor and then you've had a lot of experience now with yoga and and that transition, how How does that come up with? Like do the parts is I guess it's you know the wherever you go. There you are Book quote of it's the same parts of you and the different practices and at the different ages like you were showing the face app with you and like it's still, it's still the same part to be compassionate with which is why that beginning with you is that it
➡️ Annie Altman (39:54): the space between breaths, the In and to use what you were saying of compassion, is dealing with what arises I was reflecting on that with what you were saying of that moment in a class where you're like, fuck what's the sequence and dealing with what arises of okay? You temporarily forgot the sequence. Take a pause, take a breath. Let it let it come back to you.
Deacon Conroy (41:27): Yeah, I just you know get them to come. I mean obviously you you know, you go on a classmate class basis but it's like, yeah, that's like if people can't do the shit that you want them to do, And meet that, like, how can you take care of them? How can you meet them where they are? You know, like, that's I think that's what makes a good teacher. It's like meet the students where they are and no matter where they're at, because it's not about you.
➡️ Annie Altman (41:51): And to tie that to talking to the different voices. Part of you meeting those voices, those parts those stories where they are. Yeah, it's the same
➡️ Annie Altman (47:15): That is what is arising? This episode has felt like such a mind fuck in the best of ways. Thank you very much.

August 13, 2019: Annie publishes the 41st episode of her podcast: 41. Creating a home for yourSelf with Kyle Kelley #2

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➡️ Annie Altman (16:46): totally and using specific, the specific tool of being with 🟠🟠talking to holding space for your child self your these inner parts of yourself that maybe didn't get care when you were like oh that definitely, you know, that I guess weren't that word traumatized or regardless of Just giving attention to those parts as a way to understand that, that resonates a lot. I resonate a lot with that understanding. My truth myself trusting Myself by giving attention to to those parts. I had that resistance to give attention to🟠🟠

August 14, 2019 -- Annie publishes Introducing The HumAnnie - please help!!! on her YouTube channel.

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Note: Annie seems rather...it's hard to describe -- agitated? high-energy? anxious? on edge? desperate? animated? -- in this video. (Watch the video yourself, and I think you'll see what I'm talking about.)
Note 2: As I mentioned earlier in this Timeline -- it is hard (or at least, would take quite a long time) for me to note down every change in body language, facial expression, tone, loudness, pace, etc. that Annie displays in these videos (or, e.g., that Sam and Jack display in [YC16a].) I've noted a few in this transcript, but, once again, watching the videos themselves will enable you to see more information than what I've been able to capture solely in text.

0:00 -- "Hi! Nice to meet you. My name is Annie Altman, and I'm two years in, and two years overdue, to asking the Internet for help with the HumAnnie. The Annie Altman Show projects are field research for the HumAnnie, an interactive stand-up comedy musical philosophy show about how no one ever fully knows how to be a human being. And my journey to accepting that truth that I enunciated. There's not a point -- it -- you know, I've talked to seven- to seventy-year-old's -- nobody has this point where they're like, 'Oh my gosh, I figured out how to be a human, now I know!' S-so, so, I'm, I'm not gonna keep waiting for that point to happen! 'Cause that's a silly expectation, past Annie. So [laughs] the HumAnnie organizes the human experience -- because organization is my coping mechanism [uplifts palms in a shrugging gesture] -- into 10 'C' themes that all humans seem to encounter at some point, in some way, in their human'ing. So. Here I go. {Holds up 1 finger: } 'Consciousness', {Holds up 2 fingers: } 'Choice', {3 fingers: } 'Change', {4 fingers: } 'Compassion' {5: } 'Communication', {6: } 'Community', {7: } 'Creation', {8: } 'Charge', {9: } 'Curiosity', and {10: } 'Courage'. And these 10 'C' themes are connected by the overarching theme of 'Connection'. The themes exist within 'Connection'. And, the themes can be visualized on the bell curve graph -- [traces a bell curve in the air with her finger] whoooo -- which is a 'C' rotated, or maybe it's a 'C' rotated this way -- I don't know how camera flips things here. Technology is not my strength. [Looks to the side, shakes head, laughs, uplifts palms in a shrugging motion] Yeah. I was on the pre-med route and then I took a hard left towards entertainment. And I brought my passion about mind-body connection along with me to the podcast, to the blog, music, movement, comedy, questions, food projects. [Looks to the side] Wherever I go, there it is! The podcast was originally called 'True Shit.' And while that's still the essence, iTunes doesn't allow even self-censored expletives [pauses] ssssoo, my name isn't a curse word, so, here I am. And today is the podcast's first birthday! Happy birthday podcast! 'Happy birthday to you' -- okay. I am occasionally too extroverted for my own good. And, I'm learning how to use that best, and worst, quality of mine, because I'm a believer that humans' best qualities are usually their worst qualities as well [moves hands together and apart in the air in sliding motions, switching each hand from the forefront to the background (likely to reference 'best vs. worst')]. So maybe duality's not real, and everything's made up! [Shakes hands around head] Wooooo! I believe it's super important, super super super [shakes head, voice rises] super super important to share the themes of the human experience to remind us all that we're all connected. We're way more similar than we are different. Like -- genetically, spiritually, in all of the ways, you -- we're more like than we are different. And our differences have so much to teach us. We're connected, we really are, through our joys, our truths, our challenges [pauses, sighs] and, at the very least, all of this feels very, very important to my personal joys, truths, and challenges, and my actions are the only ones that I have any control over. [Raises hands in air about her head and and waves her hands about] Newsflash, Annie! [Exhales loudly] Huhhh! [Laughs] So, remembering that all humans are humans, the most effective way to minimize human suffering is to maximize resource equity. Hurt people hurt people, and people with access to resources are less likely to harm other people to obtain resources. [Does mind-blown gesture with her hands] Equality is treating everybody the same. And equity is ensuring that everybody has the same baseline to then be treated equally. Maslow's hierarchy of needs reminds us that food, water, and shelter are literal necessities for people to even have the opportunity for 'self-actualization' -- whatever you want to define that as. The HumAnnie shares my journey with more than two mental health labels, and all sorts of disordered tendencies with food, and my body image, and it redirects all of that energy I had placed into making super rigid, controlling rules about food, and all of life -- into, how can we collectively, as humans, distribute resources? Starting with food. And all of life-things. Call it a Jewish stereotype, I care about food a lot. So please -- thank you for watching -- please share this video, please share the website, please share a podcast, please -- [voice rises] share your feelings! And share, what-whatever you can to help me learn that I am allowed to ask for help. Because, oh my gosh, Annie, it's like you're making this whole thing about connection to remind yourself that you're connected. [Inhales and exhales loudly] Art is fun, huh? Thank you so much for listening. Thank you for being you. [Pauses] [Laughs]

August 25, 2019: Annie publishes the 43rd episode of her podcast: 43. Yes and, Annie: black-and-white vs. gray

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Annie Altman (23:18): a lot of people who are black and white thinkers would also identify as perfectionists, and people who Part of why your my mind is making this framework of black and white is wanting there to be a right and wrong so that we can say we're doing things right? 🟡That I'm being perfect because there's a black and white and I'm doing things in either the black or the white way or whatever is the right way for that thing to be doing things. And that to me is directly tied to accepting unknowns letting go of control, letting go in general🟡 and if you deal with mental health, labels or not in your life, letting go is a theme of the human existence because new information keeps coming in to be processed new feelings. Emotional information keeps keeps coming around and all we can do is Filter. Some of it because we only have so much space and so we got to let go of some of it. and, that. That's a doozy for me. Sometimes, for all people, especially, and for all people. And I seem, I feel to, I feel like I have A deep. Challenging story that I have attached to that, I have addicted to that. It is challenging for me. because with my black and white extremism, when I decide to let something go, I I tend to let go as intensely as I've held on. Like, I'm like the the metaphor with my hand would be like gripping, so so tightly and then the letting go is like, throwing something on the ground, even that sounds so angry. Hey anger, and it is though, it's like if it's something I'm holding on to that in. Well that's not true. Sometimes there's things I hold onto that intensely and then It's almost like I fall asleep and and it is a falling out of my hand. I guess there's only a couple of examples. I can think of Where I've thrown things. There's definitely been times, where I feel like I have attached to an idea. a concept, just a story and I gripped it really hard in my hand and then him talking to friends and people that I trust talking to a trained therapist and in doing yoga journaling, whatever the practice is that I need for that particular thing. Then
Annie Altman (30:19): So, it is a value end of use Annie. and it took a lot of podcast episodes for me to Decently dramatically. Hello, 🟡black and white brain thinking creating stories.🟡 Message my best friend. To ask for help with the podcast and say I need your help and 🟡it took two years into working on the humanity for me to put a video on YouTube. That said, I need your help.🟡 And that's silly. That's just silly. We're all social creatures. We need people. We need
Annie Altman (33:37): is the x-axis of the graph, if you're seeing that in your head, potentially that made sense to somebody. Okay, so what are my takeaways for this episode? What are takeaways for someone who was like? Yeah, I'm still listening to this because in these In this. Okay essentially this is this is one side to talk therapy, talk like that. This is not talk therapy because they're not therapists here. This is. Voice journaling therapy. That's the, that's a vulnerability of it and that's the practice for the humanity, which is once I did talk there be and, The yes. And and why that is such a useful. 🟡Phrase for me is that I really resisted talk therapy. When I was first exposed to it in high school. I felt like, I wasn't allowed to. be honest with the person that I was going to that talking about my family, my friends, talking about people who weren't in the room it brought so much guilt up for me that I felt I wasn't allowed to talk about them.🟡 That I felt a lot of guilt also about so much privilege. And how 🟠🟠how could I have all of these mental health issues that I'm dealing with when I have access to all of my basic needs.🟠🟠 And feeling that I was not allowed to. Seek help because there were people who needed more help. And if you've had that experience, I'm here to tell you that, that is bullshit. We all suffer suffering is relevant. The only way you are going to help anybody is for you to help yourself. Maybe on the surface, like, you know, a handful of times, you could help someone else by burning yourself out which I've done that one. And in my experience, those come back around to bite. You bite me, they come back around a baby. Yeah. In some way, because I went to the point of burnout, I went to that over, efforting in the effort versus ease. yes, and and, It. much like an opening with all of these different projects that I'm doing, and similarly in therapy, which honestly, the like these projects are a form of public therapy to encourage people to therapy as themselves through. Me therapizing myself because like I said, that's the only therapizing that I have direct control over. So my extremist is like, going all in and and sharing All In. Because that's all I can control. So I'm gonna control the fuck out of it. A little like Community side note for people here. I, Believe firmly that the more controlling someone is in their work life more. They want to be controlled sexually and vice versa. And that director producer, mine seemed to be the exception of this. If people were just want to be controlling fucking everywhere, I am here for it. You do you everybody? And you do, whoever you want to do consensually? ah, and I would say Also, take away for someone listening for someone listening, the podcast is to, to lean into that, vulnerability to lean into that. Bit of of discomfort and to be mindful of where it's paying and to back off from pain. and also, to lean in where where you can learn a little bit more about you, about your, your boundaries, your creation, your desires, where, where you're going Your preferences. Where you are on this bell? Curve Spectrum, supposedly, are you someone who swims around in the gray? Or do you attached to the wall of black, or the attach the wall of white? And, and then get really curious. See about why, why are you why are you there? What's going on? How does it feel? Oh, that's the question really for me to focus on is. Okay, how does it feel? Because you're allowed to have needs and checking with your feelings and then make decisions based off of them. and I wonder with black and white vs grey, she gets to at the end of the episode that so much of the, the quote, scientific rational mind is this black and white thinking is the Numerical the binary the 01 which to talk about sex. Another time I was just sharing very recently and Share pretty recently or like or share pretty frequently, excuse me. My belief also, I'm tearing beliefs. In the binary sexually that people tend to 0 or 1 other people pretty soon in meeting them of. Yes, I would have sex with this person. No, I would not, which doesn't always mean that you That that would have liked if someone's one that doesn't necessarily mean that. Oh, I'm gonna pursue that. All right, want to right now, or just that sort of evolutionary binary because at the end of At a certain moment there is a yes or no. Black or white consent to in a consensual sexual relationship. There is a consent of yes I will have sex with, you know, I won't there and that is an example of their being Some black and white. Some black and white things that exist. And yeah, so that binary so that 01 sort of numerical science perspective on the world with the, the past pre-med in me loves and finds so much safety and stability. And also just is interesting to me with, you know, clearly I like talking about graphs. and, Seeing how that connects and the grey space is the feeling space. The feels the emotions, the learning about the the whole Spectrum, all of, you know, light being wavelengths or different shades of grey and Noticing the contrast seeing. The little details.
Annie Altman (42:02): black and white in each of their pristine black pristine White. I used pristine purposely there because it's generally associated with white, which is how did that get into language and And they can use, they have the whole palette of emotional existence. Which includes zero one includes boundaries and includes. The whole thing. Yes. And Annie. Yes. and, All right. Well, this is felt like and emotional clusterfuck which is a word that's been in my head a lot in recently, as fuck gives a lot to my soul, Ah, and emotions often feel like cluster fucked me because they're so gray. And I'm like, where what's the right emotion? What's the right? Emotional response and that's not how emotions work dude. At Goofiness clearly important to me as well. We're all very paradoxical. Life? I a Humanity theme is talking about just how weird and paradoxical all of life is so yes, and

August 27, 2019: Annie publishes the 45th episode of her podcast: 45. Yes and, Annie: black-and-white vs. gray (take 2)

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Anne Altman (1:43): So to start with to answer my own question to my self of what is truth to you. To me the word truth is rooted in Trust. And I believe everything is feeling. Everyone is making feelings based decisions and then intellectualizing larger sizing. Why? They're making those feelings to decisions and to me trust and Truth or feelings, it's something. 🟠🟠It's a, it's a feeling of safety. which I can describe best as a Relaxing, in my central nervous system.🟠🟠 Which can include butterflies. Excitement, happiness, joy, all of All of those sort of spikes and some, it's like the people feeling. like the cliche of male-female, dynamic of males being offended of being called safe that I a female will say they feel safe. Well, and I'm putting that in hero normative terms and it is real there. And It is also. To me and evolutionary. Thing that we all crave safety. I have found for me. That truth is where I feel a lot of safety because so much of Life Is So unknown, which is where so much of the fun. Is. And because unknowns are to me synonymous with it's going to say synonymous with things anxiety and that that's not entirely true that has been true in a lot of my experience. And also anxiety can be smallest with excitement. part of what I find gives me more space to explore more unknowns is to have Baseline truth. Trust safe. Safety a safety. Net for that term. And part of the structure of the ten season of the humanity is a safety net. Having a true shit thesis statement for the podcast. Topic is a safety and it's it's a life raft. Is another metaphor of something to to hold on to Well, I let go of other things and explore. Let go of expectations ideas about things that I'm going into in the unknown.
Annie Altman (7:13): and also in my personal experience. Getting overly attached to. Just black and white or getting overly attached to Gray and everything being gray and up rigidly boxing me into a perspective where I'm missing out on a lot of the spectrum of what is actually happening in life. And black and white thinking can also be called catastrophizing, going to an extreme. And I definitely am an extremist personality who enjoys exploring the extremes and and finds comfort in the black and white perhaps because they are Seemingly more clear and straightforward and also finds that learning about the black and white helps me learn about the gray and vice versa. It's Perhaps the circle is also a spectrum or maybe some sort of circle with a shading.
Annie Altman (10:14): it's a It's interesting, the more I talk about it in the more. I'm aware of how much my Tendencies are to go towards black and white. in terms of what I share with other people, because sharing the gray, feels vulnerable because it's feeling and it feels Messy. And it feels because it's that a known. I feel less of a known certainty in sharing Then the comfort of sharing more black and white. Things that I feel have more quote proof, there's something manifest. There's a tangible something.
Annie Altman (11:23): My potentially, that is another example of my extremism of committing really hard to One path, and then committing really hard to another. And so, I committed really hard to the black and white science path, and then I kind of really hard to this gray artistic path. And what I feel now is, I'm, I'm figuring out the ways to merge them and give structure to the podcast to connect the podcast, more directly to the show, to put more of the show out there to talk through the show to To do all of these things that are. Yes, anding that part of me that has that very analytical and black and white mind and use that. Well, also using this gray part of meat brain matters gray matter for more wordplay of things. and, That seems to be my pattern to sort of touch one wall and then touch the other wall and then work my way. Past Center, and then work my way back to Center. and kind of like the pendulum swinging that is That is always swinging. In in some ways. So, I black and white thinking is very much a mental health topic, which is A topic. I have lots of experience with Experiencing And discussing. And sometimes I wonder how much. when people talk about the emotion wheel and this whole spectrum of emotions I do, I feel like each emotion exists on a spectrum and also I feel like if you keep, boiling down zooming in compiling, the data that eventually there are only two emotions
Annie Altman (14:48): And at the same time, bringing all the parts along is kind of a total klusterfuk and and in terms of how this topic is personally relevant to me with all these different annual projects that I'm doing towards the humanity? it is a lot of different parts that I'm bringing with me and figuring out how to hold the space as they say. And as I say, in slight sarcasm, as I learned to say for real, all these different parts and the parts of me that like yoga and dancing and singing and the parts that want to write and the parts that want to talk to people and the parts, the one to make food and all of these different aspects, like the learning comedy learning improv that I can bring all of these parts into the humanity and in fact, that is a big piece of what is what I view is its uniqueness is that I'm bringing all of the parts rather than leaving a part out. and, It's like very much feels like that. Like leaving the house with a bunch of little kids and I'm Collecting all of them and getting them all ready. Getting them all ready to go. And this seems to be really
Annie Altman (17:13): To be a human, the more that we can. Let people figure out their own answer, their own truth. Or how they can. Look at the Spectrum of their own thought process and feelings and human being. And make decisions in their human doing that align with their human being that put that out into the world for everybody because It really is in my mind that walking is slow, is the slowest member. And so it is in everyone's best interest for anyone to be helped because we are all walking each other home as quote goes. The the black white thinking with mental, health has been a really big inspiration for all of these projects and for the humanity and putting out. Talking about mental health openly for my own practice of doing that. And for the encouragement of other people to do that and for the encouragement of people, supporting loved ones with their mental health. And what I can share for my experience of all of those things and how that can lead someone to, To help their experience. To maybe open up. In my mind and my heart. The goal of any is to open up to put a light to give some space to something that someone otherwise wouldn't. Because all these things philosophizing giving space to feelings checking with your emotions. These are all Privileges and to me, they're actually basic rights. Because hurt people are going to hurt people. And so the more everyone is taking care of meaning, the more they have time and space to take care of themselves, the more they have resources to take care of themselves. That is the most effective route I believe to minimize human suffering.
Annie Altman (24:11): and to help people. And that being a an emotional burden of potential, emotional labor or a lesson in setting, emotional boundaries in the same way that my black and white thinking is a lesson and setting a boundary from black and white thinking maybe in using that for that. In Consciousness, in zooming out in being aware of what is happening, which A lot of black and white thinking as well can come to control and how little control that anyone has in the world. And I have had a lot of experience with Hyper. Controlling food has been a big Outlet of mental health, and black and white thinking, for me of literally every type of disordered eating And every type of rule of what kind of food I can eat and how much, and when and 🟡all of all of the things from this black and white belief. that came from a desire for rules, and this This wish that life was black and white cause and effect all the time,🟡 which it sometimes is. And to say, oh if I do this in this way, then this thing will happen and I have control over what is going on, 🔴🔴🔴which all comes from the root of not having control over when I die and not having control over when life is done🔴🔴🔴 and among many other things of not having control, that one being I was a real cough. The root of. That fear of unknown that we all have because we're all born. We don't know how we got here. We don't know when we're leaving here, unless people choose it which is a reference to suicide and that might be an override of every evolutionary impulse. So are they choosing that? That's a separate podcast? All these things are really important for me. I'm going back into mental health, generally and away from food and to touch on suicide, 🟠🟠I believe that. People commit suicide. Yes. Because they feel suicidal and because they're feeling that in addition to feeling unable to share with someone about those feelings and that black and white boxed in or overly swimming in the gray without something to, to hold, and, The only I real action I have of what I can do towards towards that to help that is is for me to talk about my life. My mental health my views on Humanity because that's all I have control over is what I put out there.🟠🟠 And so, that is how I hope that this is useful to. someone listening is that it inspires them to to put their truth out there. However, that feels Best to them to look at their black and white, their gray.
Annie Altman (27:59): And I really do believe that everyone's perspective is valuable. And so everyone sharing it in some way that feels good to them. Is valuable for everyone. and, because all I can speak from is my own experience and the value that I've received from putting the things out there in this way, that feels good to me. and, With. Black and white thinking. Again, being a strength and a weakness. 🟠🟠The inner mean voices of mine that are rooted in really intense, black and white thinking🟠🟠 will respond pretty reasonably to black and white thinking back to them to me saying hey no black and white thinking is still black and white thinking to me presenting cause and effect data quote on quote of just putting out a podcast, even consistently and not being a data point, and A way that I can. Almost give that quality of mine or flexion on the other side. Of the graph. And Perhaps, that's really what they use for someone listening that I that I care that. I Wish someone walks away. With this from is that whatever? That that thing is that you're the most insecure of. Because in my experience this black and white thinking that I have so much insecurity of because of feeling this vulnerability, that it shines a spotlight on my mental health and me being a messy human. An emotionally messy human times, physically messy emotionally. Messy is what I care about. being seen as and what I'm doing with the humanity and the Annie Altman show, projects is letting that leaning into that and letting that That thing that. Well, to bring this back, full circle to trust. This thing that. I impulse says to trust and my fear is scared to. And so, I encourage you listening to First really give yourself the time and space to figure out what that thing is. What, what is that thing? That feels I like to ask a question of relief, first regret that feels like it would be a relief to share to put out in some way. Into what you are giving back in your Exchange. Of Consciousness for the charge C. Just feels really rambly at the moment. And and to to lean into that and to explore how you can use. that thing, because, it seems really likely in my experience that that thing. is exactly the thing for you to lean into, To contribute to Consciousness collectively. Because that is the thing that your Consciousness is exploring the edges of whoa. That for me, my, my OCD part, which is a one with black and white thinking that all get insecure about

September 3, 2019: Annie publishes the 46th episode of her podcast: 46. Money is a tool to allocate your values with Jenna Rodrigues

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➡️ Annie Altman (17:50): Oh, that's a great question. I I would say experiences. Is my number one. I would always say that food. especially, for the past few years has been A consistent value for me. As. Something I care a lot about. what I'm putting in my body and also What dollar voting? I am doing towards food and food distribution. Ah, that's a great question. So I I have I've had I've experienced lots of forms of disordered eating and essentially just rigidly food and making a lot of food rules. 🔴🔴🔴And I since I was really little had a lot of feelings about The fact that food. Is not allocated to everyone. It's not. I didn't have that word when I was in kindergarten.🔴🔴🔴 When there's any of it it's and it's still makes literally zero sense to me that there's more than enough food for everyone. and their people without food, and Oh my God. Depressing realizations of getting older looking into systems of following the money and all of that to see that. That is because the distribution of food and the distribution of clean water and shelter. And then, you know, going up Maslow's pyramid into Distributing education and two education about money in these things and there's so many Things you have to start at the bottom. and, Big. Bridging those two. Feelings has been. potentially, the root inspiration for the humanity of all I know to do what I feel, like I can contribute to this and give value to This thing that I value the way I can allocate the resources of my human being and what I know and can do right now is to talk about it. And to Provide space for reflection and ask questions about it and bring attention to it. 🔴🔴🔴My senior superlative was least, likely not to say something, and I really feel like, it's I really feel like I took a lot of intense energy. I still am. Of this controlling food and body image, and really just rigidly controlling life and death. And being scared about not controlling death.🔴🔴🔴 And all it all comes back to at some point. and redirected that towards talking about food distribution, talking about things like this of hey money is made up tool and a concept and we can use that we can then make money whatever we want and we make the economy collectively with how we vote with our dollars and so that means that people being with their basic resources is a human decision that choice C and honestly that is what depressed the most about Humanity Jenna. Like I not like I am For the most part, I skew towards an optimist. and I feel like because I just I'm so extroverted and I love people so much that it's it can be easy for me to like, Laugh at and with something I like that. Somebody does that. I see or that I'm doing like something that's very human. I really get a kick out of that sort of observation. And I honestly like since I was had this awareness of wait a minute, there's plenty of food for everyone. Why are there people without food? And you know, put any other resource in there and money is a tool to allocate resources. that I have this deep sadness, depression, this just ick this, uh, of Wait, how are we not chosing to do that? We think about all the things that we have distributed to everybody when we've prioritized it like you think about all the places you can put on secrets and Wi-Fi? There's clear examples of us Distributing things to everyone when we prioritize it, I'm getting on such a freaking soapbox. I have so many feelings about this and yeah, and feeling about this.
➡️ Annie Altman (38:22): If I do this 🟡for me, the fear was, I'm gonna lose control for so many people. It's, if I, if I don't make rules about food, I'm gonna lose control. And then I'm gonna be so fat, and fat looks cool, bad. And that is bad to be, and this whole shame spiral🟡 and I really believe there's just so much thing similar with both of them. Have not talking about it, that people people have this ingrained belief that this is such a long diary that if they give money without restriction, that somehow people are just going to be lazy and sit around and do nothing rather than actually have the time. And Spain 🟡not be in that fight, or flight mode. Fight, fight fight, Freeze, where they're stressed🟡 and have the time and study something to make art to do something that contributes to everyone. So, Yeah. Thank you for somehow getting getting me to that and for listening to all of it, I'm curious your first reflection. Yeah.

September 1, 2019 -- Annie publishes 5 ways to support a loved one’s mental health on her YouTube channel.

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Note:
- The subtext here, I'm guessing, is that this video was not-so-subtly addressed to Sam, Jack, Max, and Connie. It seems likely to me that Annie's "5 ways" are things that she was frustrated with Sam, Connie, Jack, and Max for not doing when working with her on her mental health challenges. (And the phrases "working with" and "mental health challenges" are doing a lot of the lifting here -- they may take on very different meanings depending on what world we're in, e.g. [a world in which Annie's claims are true] vs. [a world in which they are not].) That is, for every "way" or "recommendation" that Annie provides, it seems that Annie may have felt that Sam, Connie, Jack, and Max were not doing that, or were doing the opposite of that.
- Also relevant here are the events alleged to have occurred just before Annie posted this video on her YouTube channel, i.e., as covered above in this Timeline:
  - Connie, Sam, Jack and Max letting Annie think she'd be receiving money left by her late father, and then
  - Connie withholding that money from Annie only after Annie had quit her job, and then
  - Connie, Sam, Jack, and Max subsequently refusing to provide Annie with financial support.

0:40 -- "I'm speaking from my own experience, with different mental health labels, and different tools and things that are helpful, for me, and ways that I feel supported by my loved ones with my mental health...Way number one, to support a loved one's mental health, is to be honest, and to focus on 'I' statements. For me, this creates a feeling of trust, and safety, and of accountability. And, the more that can be fostered, the easier communication feels for me. Number two is to remember and remind them that everyone is responsible for their own feelings, because no one can feel your feelings for you -- that everyone does need to take accountability, responsibility, ownership for their mental health -- their health -- and also we're all connected, and it's okay to feel whatever you're feeling, because it's just a feeling, and it's there to teach you something, to give some sort of information, and resisting and pushing away from it is only going to create more things to come up. Number three is to is to validate someone's efforts at supporting their mental health, and to acknowledge and remind them of the ways that they are doing things to support their mental health, and that you see that, that, that they're doing it. And that validation and acknowledgment, again, for me, is a way to really build trust, that when someone is coming to me with any sort of advice or feedback or reflections about my choices, my life, my anything, that it's coming from a place of really wanting to help me, because they're first acknowledging the ways that I'm doing things to take responsibility and help myself. The fourth way to help support a loved one's mental health is to encourage them to touch base with their mental health practices, so number three...validating the ways that they have practices to help their mental health, to encourage them to touch base for those, and to experiment with new ones, perhaps, or to experiment with deepening the ones that feel good to them and remind them of the tools that they have in place and that there are multiple tools that they have on their tool belt. Again, kinda tied to {number} three, of validating the tools they have, and encourage them to do that, because, to go back up to number two, everyone's responsible for their own feelings, so...you can't walk for someone. The fifth way to support a loved one's mental health, from my experience of, what feels really supportive, is to ask questions, and help them find their answers, rather than, to focus on offering solutions or offering what you believe is the best course of action. To really focus on asking them questions about describing how they're feeling, or where in their body they're feeling it, to be really clear about their intentions with their different mental health tools and how they're taking care of it, and to be accountable for their choices and what they're doing. And then just circle back up to honesty, to, to be really honest about, you know, is someone doing something that they're passionate about and making something and, and, consuming and creating in a cycle in society, is someone connecting with people and socializing in ways that feel good to them and, and feel that, that feel nurturing, that connect them to a community of humans, Internet and otherwise and an actual physical home reality. And I feel like questions are a great way to help someone to to step back and look at what's going on, and to self-reflect. And so that is something that feels very supportive for me, when people ask me questions. And to touch base on that theme, again, of, building trust, asking questions rather than giving advice and telling someone what they're supposed to be doing, to take care of themselves -- can build that trust that shows, with your actions, that you validate their decision-making, and that you support their decision-making, and they're learning about themselves and that you're there to support them in supporting themselves."

September 2, 2019 -- Annie publishes Reflections on guilt vs shame on her YouTube channel.

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0:00 -- "What's up YouTube? I am here to talk about the difference between shame, and guilt. Because, learning this distinction has been incredibly valuable in my mental health, health, life and perhaps it can be valuable information for you as well. So the base definition -- difference -- of shame and guilt are that guilt is the feeling of 'I did something bad.' It's action-based, and then a 'bad'...it's an action that is bad. And shame is, 'I am bad', as a being. So guilt, 'I did something bad, my actions are bad.' Shame, 'I am bad. My being-ness is bad.' And those can be really easy to confuse, because they're both labeling as 'bad', and 'wrong', and some way of telling yourself you're a fuck-up, for other language. And, being able to separate which is which, and be curious about what's coming up, and [pauses] when you really boil it down, is that feeling or thought that is rising rooted in 'I did something bad' or 'I am bad'? And for me, that's a super helpful way to understand my feelings and my thoughts [pauses] in new ways. And also, then, to inform my decision-making, going forward, about which thoughts and feelings I listen to and trust, that are coming up, and what I follow. So, in my experience [pauses] guilt is a tool, is a helpful and harmful tool. And shame is -- is a -- [pauses, pulls down at the air with her hand, to represent:] a vacuum [pauses] yeah. Shame is a vacuum. Like it just sucks out -- life. Guilt can be helpful and harmful. So, excessive guilt is a lot to carry, around it's excessive, it's heavy, if you're constantly telling yourself -- which I've lived this -- every decision-making I'm doing is wrong and bad, in all facets of-of my life, and that's exhausting, to constantly -- [laughs, adjusts her glasses] these glasses are {unintelligible} -- to constantly beat yourself up, like you know, be like, 'Oh, it's wrong that my glasses are falling' -- like, if I'm, you know, 'Oh it's so -- it's so wrong, that I'm doing it, how could -- it's so bad of me to film a video that is not perfectly, whatever' -- that can be debilitating, to get in the way of all of your thoughts, and feelings, and it does -- it makes no space for any -- it takes away space from other things. And at the same time, that guilt voice can be the voice of your conscience. It can be a conscious voice of, so -- to the example of my perfectionist voice. that can also be the voice that is, what is, detail-oriented about me, and observing things, and seeing connections between things, and [pauses] it is helpful, in addition to being harmful. And it's figuring out, with guilt, 'Is this excessive?', 'Is this useful, at all, t-to my life? Is this really what my, my priorities are, and is this aligning me towards those, or am I just using this to, berate myself, and, say things to myself in ways that are-are significantly harsher than I would ever talk to a friend. That is a really helpful tool as well, of talking to yourself like you would talk to a friend, and checking yourself on your reactions to your thoughts and feelings, and noticing if you are saying things in a way that are very different from what you would say to a friend. So, on the other -- there's guil -- so on the 'versus', in that transition, there is shame, and part of why that, 'What would you say to a friend?' tool is helpful here is that, in my experience, shame is not my voice. Shame is a voice of someone else, be it a particular individual, or, a, collective group of individuals, an institution, a [pauses, gestures about with hands] something else that is not, that is not my voice. Think about a baby coming into the world, and starting to learn how to make decisions, and navigate, and-and walk -- like, to crawl, move around, all of that. [Pauses] If a baby -- okay, if a baby is walking learning to walk, and they fall - first of all, that, that shame, you know, what what adult is like, 'Shame on you for falling, baby!' Like, come on. And you're like, 'Aww, look how cute!' you know, and like, 'You go baby', like, 'Fail until you -- failing is part of the process!' And, and that's great! And the, the -- well, the awareness of self-talk is, is different. The best idea I have of [exhales, laughs, voice changes] a baby and her self-dialogue, learning to walk, is, is like, is a, sort of 'darn', if they fall, 'I messed up', and then they get up and keep walking. Whereas [pauses] this, this idea of [pauses, doesn't finish the thought] -- What I'm, what I'm getting at here is-[laughs]-is -- little kids aren't going around saying that [voice rises] they're bad because they don't know how to walk immediately, or how to cut their own food up, or whatever they're doing, like, little -- very young kids, before a certain age when [voice changes] 'The world makes you bitter', she says sarcastically -- 'cause it's true! -- before you are [pauses] inundated with so much of the world [pauses] the-the voice is guilt, and it's directing towards, 'Oh', you know, 'I feel guilty if I, if I take, my [pauses] -- if I go to preschool, I feel bad if I take someone's cookies, or I take their spot, or if I 'whatever' from them. If I if I steal, if I hit someone -- these things, that, then teach us act-- our-- teach us accountability for our actions, and how to function in a community. The shame, is so different. The shame is so much [pauses, looks down, exhales/sighs] -- it's a vacuum, it feels deeper, it feels [shakes head, long pause] -- it, it feels -- almost more violating, is the word [shakes head, looks confused] that came into my head, in this, rambling about it. That [pauses] that shame is a really deep-seated insecurity that, I believe, adults project onto children, because they had it projected onto them when they were children, and so it becomes this cycle that we pass down, that [pauses] is shifting as people notice it and talk about the differences, and realize the differences, that, [pauses] shame isn't effective. What has changed, for any -- towards happiness, by shaming? What-what actions have -- if anything, when people say, like, 'shame spiral', in my experience, shame perpetuates behaviors, patterns, thought patterns, beliefs. It perpetuates those things. Whereas guilt, to me, is more of a, of a spotlight, of a 'Hey, let's take a look at this! Let's examine. Let's get curious, about what's going on here.' And again, can be excessive -- excessive guilt is still excessive. And shame, the more and more I sit with, distinguishing it from guilt, I feel, is, excessively heavy, for any human to hold, because we're not meant to hold it, because it's 'unnatural.' And [pauses] not all natural things are beneficial, and unnatural things can be beneficial and -- by 'unnatural', in terms of an emotional sense, what I mean is -- I could also say it's unproductive. It's ineffective. It's not useful. It is [pauses] in my experience, shame creates resistance [pauses, small laugh] whereas guilt shows you where you have resistance. [Looks about as if she is surprised by what she just said] I'm gonna need to reflect on that more, 'cause without almost nine minutes of video rambling, I'm not sure [looks quizzical] I would have ever connected them in that way. Because this started out as a very short [shakes head] video, uh, really, jus-- [cuts herself off] the base of the message here, is that guilt is 'I did something bad', and shame is 'I am bad', and that those are very different thoughts and feelings, to hold in your person. And to be aware, and to ask yourself questions about what's going on, aaannd see what you can learn, and maybe record yourself talking about it, 'cause this was a really helpful way to learn more about it. Thank you for watching, and I would love to read about any of your experiences distinguishing these two, and understanding about these two, and I would love to hear, would love to hear how these themes come up in your life. So, thanks for watching! And like, click, subscribe, rate, du-nuh-buh-buh-buh! [Laughs]"

September 3, 2019: Annie publishes the 47th episode of her podcast: 47. Yes and, Annie- black-and-white vs. gray (take 3)

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➡️ Annie Altman (0:24): and welcome to the Annie Altman show. A podcast formerly known as true shit. My name is Annie Altman and I really enjoy asking people questions about what this whole Being Human Experience is like for them. And sometimes I enjoy talking my own circles around questions. Like, in this episode, the third solo podcast This podcast is field research for the humani an interactive stand-up comedy. Musical philosophy, show about how no one ever fully knows how to be a human being. If you're listening to this now your fortunate enough to choose your truth. I choose to believe that objectivity is the sum of subjectivities meaning humans, collectively create truth. I'm here today with the Third. of the solo episode, The of the solo podcasts and the third take of black and white vs Grey So yes, and between those two. Those two extremes, those two ends and I'm recording this. The latest I've ever recorded a podcast. A, and I'm sleepy and tired, and emotionally tired and figured, you know? why not turn the microphone on anyway, and And see what happens. Because of timing in this being, the time I have to record it. So You know, potentially it's gonna keep this really short. That's the That's the game plan here. I've done this twice before, I've talked through this topic, I'm gonna talk about this topic. It seems for a lifetime. and it's because of black and white thinking, being a pattern that I am very familiar with and A lesson that I get to learn a lot. To check in about. so, to go right into the heart of the HumAnnie of no one knowing how to human and also they're being seems to human and discussing those themes, being an important part of discussing equity and resource distribution and how we as a collective of humans manage our Ourselves as a whole community. The where black and white thinking and space for the gray. And and looking at that whole Spectrum, Continuum all of it. eventually, what it comes down to for me, where I got to The humanity in the formats in now is that there is no right and wrong way to human. scientists isn't right. Artist isn't right. It's not how this works. Apparently, and I put a lot of emotional energy into really wanting it to work that way and sheer force of will and emotional. Desiring is not. It is an effective learning opportunity. 🟡I I've definitely had so many versions of the feeling of. Oh, if the whole world went vegan, smoked pot, did psychedelics composted some of which are things, I If? I I see in different ways and it's still it's the same fucking bulshit of, oh, if only this thing happened, then the whole world would be better. Oh, if only I did this thing that I would be better, and, That's not how life goes. I am. Talking through to remind myself to accept. Their. Their is no, right and wrong.🟡 There is no right? And there is no wrong because we're making those Concepts up there as made up as the words that I am using two. Convey those Concepts. And yes, and of this. Black and white and gray. And it being, yes, and is that For each individual human. Who is yes? And part of the collective of humans. Which is a fun mind fuck for each individual human, there is a right and a wrong way for them to human in terms of Right. Being what aligns them with themselves. What makes them feel the most them. And only that individual can can figure that out. And there's some themes overall. Across a lot of humans statistically. And there's still so much, individual variation. And that, and 🟡for me personally, that's where I've run into a lot of challenges is wanting to do things how other people do them🟡 and or how these statistical average does them. 🟡rather than really being honest with myself about What I want? What I need. What feels most me to me.🟡 And in my experience, that's because that's difficult to do or, or it's that's the like, the getting on the yoga. Mat part being difficult. It's it can feel really daunting to start. 🟠🟠And sometimes it can again, be really emotionally exhausting to do that self-reflection.🟠🟠 And it seems in my experience to be more exhausting in a long run not to because hashtag Yolo there's you only live once and this lifetime in this whatever or that's bulshit you only live once and so because no one else spends more time with you than you because no one else can know you more than you. Who else? Besides you can learn, what is your right and your wrong way to be a human. Well, also, yes. And that there is no, right, and that there is no wrong and that The only always is learning something. Cliche is that are cliches for recents? Oh, the singing. I'm tired. Sunny that just Sunny was because of her wonderful pointing out to me which is true in terms of right and wrong about vulnerability. And me going towards singing and Goofy voices with emotional vulnerability. and, To use that as an example. Because I just did it that That isn't a right or wrong, that is. Me. Doing what is aligned with me right now. and, Having someone to reflect that. And to point out the ways that I can learn from that is Beyond valuable, because Because I I need that reflection. This is the we are social creatures. And We are the only ones responsible for our own happiness. and that's a weird thing to sit with, Their. Heat. The yes. And keeps coming around that they're our rules and that are rules and how are those both true? Somehow they are. You need to have opinions and also your opinions are just opinions Duality exists and Duality definitely doesn't exist. Contrast is quote, real, in the sense that It is a real tool that we learn from in this. Physical reality. Oh this is sounding like really trippy and this like this is like stoned and sleepy Annie though. I definitely sound often like someone who's done psychedelics a lot more than I've actually done them. Where was I in my ramblings here. Contrast is is where we learn. Which seems potentially goofy to say with. Yes. And and, To me. The yes. And means that contrast exists. That there is this. Yes. And there is this and, For a while. Like really until doing this third take of the podcast. I looked at contrast. In the comparison of black and white. That's speaks again. My black and white thinking mind and the conditioning of this Western World and black and white thinking. And That contrast and learning about contrast is going to be black versus white. and, Not until doing the third. Take this podcast, have I thought about instead contrast being potentially looking at the difference between black and white and gray. which, Reflects to me on the contrast. Between. that a lot of people will talk about of Oats love versus hate. Or. it's love versus fear, and To me, it's love versus indifference. The opposite of the opposite of Love is indifference. Is. There's not giving a fuk. How does that relate to these color thing, though? Annie it does Somewhere In My Head. The hint. so, maybe that love is the Great Space. And in different is the black and white. The boundaries of it, the sort of harder lines. Which is necessary at times, if you're always super emotionally invested in everything, you're gonna burn out really quickly. I say from experience. and if you are always indifferent, then you're missing out on engaging emotionally with your life. Oh, is this relevant? the conclusion of life is that there is no conclusion besides dying which we all do, which is a beautiful thing because then we're all connected by doing that same thing, and No matter what decisions, we make this entire life time. We will all die. There's that is the not there. No. Right. Or wrong way to human in that in high school teacher. Who said there there's only one test that we all take and we all fail which is that we all die but there there is no. 🔴🔴🔴I guess to me and my mind, When I've gotten so caught up in attached to this black and white there. Being a right way to be human. It's been this idea that somehow I can avoid death, that somehow I'll be a human that doesn't die. Which I, I wouldn't say. I've ever felt with those exact words, or having the words that clearly. And also that is To me. That's what it comes back to is again this belief of controlling. That we want to control Our Lives as a belief that will control our deaths.🔴🔴🔴 Deaths. Pick your belief on lifetimes. We're never gonna know anyways. and, We we get a pick what we do until then, and that may or may not influence. How that happens? We I don't get a pick that. So this, this third take of Of black and white versus gray. Seems to be me. Also. giving that space for To me the gray is that sitting with all of this existential 'we all die!' Oh my gosh the world is like we're all that like that sort of I and that is necessary and part of being alive and part of really being clear on what is important to me and what my priorities are. And taking action. And resting the black and white. Doing of working sleeping connecting. The. The things that are. Much more in the here now than that existentialism. Are also necessary. and, Just doing one or the other of those. Feels unbalanced. Feels incomplete. Feels. Yeah, really like it feels like walking on unbalanced. Like on uneven light. To. Only participate in the spiritual world or to only participate in the reality manifest world. It. It to again to the point of Duality exists and it doesn't exist. Both of those worlds have. validity quote, on quote and also Who's to say, which is more valid. Our perspectives are so microscopic here in terms of what is actually going on. Which is the gray. And then also, if all I do is get caught up in how microscopic my perspective is then I Miss out on the opportunity to participate in some of the black and white of the here, now of this world. And doing things like recording a podcast. Even with feeling tired, rambly. Stoned sleepy. Now I'm like, oh no, sleeping means tired, I mean emotionally tired. I'm I'm brain fried and all so Sometimes, that is the time to let some stuff. Flow out. And Let go of some more facts about. How it? How it comes across. Bin. And in, So, what is the takeaway here for someone listening? What is my takeaway? Life's really goofy. Honestly, it's it's much funnier than anything that we can make up because there's so much Paradox in all of it, and Also, there's so many people acting like Paradox doesn't exist. She just confusing. And a necessary contrast for the people who like to talk about Paradox and a reminder that whoo. Duality doesn't exist and same truth. Paradox. Oh my gosh. There's no answer there's And the takeaway is to do your life anyways, because nobody knows what they're doing. Everyone's improving literally everything all the time. A lot of times people are this level of tired doing shit and they're still doing it. because they want to because they need to or because they Have to. And that is the part that I care about the have to. And the forcing in the basic income and the giving people the space to learn about what is there. Most of them. What is black feel like? What is white? Feel like, what is gray? Feel like to them. This is very rambly. This is been. a very interesting podcasts experience, I have no idea whether or not that will apply to the experience of listening to it. Maybe some of this made some sense. There's black, there's white, and there's gray and we need all of them. and, Limiting. Any of those limits your whole perspective. Yes. And Danny now. Go to bed. Thank you for listening and thanks for being you. Hey, thanks for sticking around till the end. Please check out the Annie Altman show.com and also patreon.com slash the Annie Altman show. If you're able and interested in donating a dollar or more per month to these projects. Non-dollar ways to Share value includes and is not limited to sharing anything. The podcast, any YouTube video and blog post, any social media account subscribing, following anywhere rating or reviewing anything sending any feedback or ideas and or connecting me with people for the podcast or other projects. You feel would enjoy this work. In my opinion, word of mouth is the only quote, real advertising. So here I am using words from my mouth.

September 3, 2019: Annie publishes the 49th episode of her podcast: 49. Yes and, Annie: life vs. death

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➡️ Annie Altman (11:11): In some way. I'm gonna switch to the YOLO phrase that got so popular. That was. really cool way that people were talking about. Life death in. A light way and all. So remembering it and remembering that. As far as we know what, all the information we're presented. This is this is it. This is our lifetime. Lives what you make it. So let's make Aunt knife and I wonder a lot of times to when I get so caught in fear of dying, I've read a couple different takes and talked to people about This concept that fear of dying. Is actually a cover for fear of living. and YOLO being the sort of reminder, to To do you? Do you boo that you're only here once? Why? Who does it serve for you to not be your most you now in this life? And I definitely resonate with that being a really scary. Undertaking to really step into. and also that, the more I address and accept and embrace and learn from that fear of really living, it does directly impact my fear of dying and my fear of people around me dying and Something that I learned was a really common 🔴🔴🔴fear that I had growing up, was the fear of my parents in their sleep. And when I was little, I Compulsively. I had to tell both my parents. I loved them before I went to bed because just in case they fell asleep and died in the middle of the night. I I needed to know that the last thing I said to them was I love you.🔴🔴🔴 and, I learned that's a that's really common for kids and 🔴🔴🔴I feel for me that was That feeling of that intense, fear of death. Can become so overwhelming.🔴🔴🔴 At times which shows how much you love someone's life. Is the other is the other side of that. and, I'm really fortunate that. I so I actually had a flight booked from Hawaii to Saint Louis the day that my dad died. So, that was a big. I was already kind of coming on to Letting go of coincidences of thing. And that was a, that was a big step in that direction. And I was fortunate. I am fortunate enough that I video chat with him the day before. And he actually did a peace sign to the camera that he put on a sideways. Kind of like poking, fun at my My hippie down. That wasn't something that he did. Normally.
➡️ Annie Altman (18:46): And change can be so scary, uncertainty can be so anxiety-inducing. and it can be so freeing, it's getting into Free Will and whether or not you believe that and how that plays into life and death
➡️ Annie Altman (20:02): Again, with extremism and my patterns of extremism and extreme, black and white thinking. Can be. It can be easy for me to fall into patterns and the game seems to be noticing it quickly. About. Being so focused on the now that I become less present because I am hyper aware of being alive in this present moment and holy fuck, how many moments had to happen for this moment to happen and all the things. Versus being hyper, aware of death. And when we get like being hyperwear of death to me is is feeling so depressed and down and It's very grounding. It's very grounding. and, Figuring out that. That balance. In terms of using the yes and of life and death and reflecting on life and death. As a way to reflect on my, on my choices, the choice C. I 🟠🟠this podcast and the HumAnnie, are my coping mechanisms for accepting death. In a way.🟠🟠 I like to say that everyone's addicted to something. We're all choosing our addictions and addictions can also be coping, mechanisms and tools.

Sunday, September 22, 2019, 1:55PM: For the first time, Sam provides Annie with access to Jerry's will, which had been withheld from Annie for over a year following Jerry's death {on May 25, 2018} by Sam, Connie, Jack, and Max, via an email:

"Sent: Sunday, September 22, 2019 1:55PM"
"To: Palumbo, Pete; Annie Altman"
"Subject: Annie Altman/Pete Palumbo"

(See the image below.)

Source: https://x.com/anniealtman108/status/1830777503960703435

This email is worrying on several levels:
- Recall: Pete -- i.e. Pete (Peter) Palumbo -- from earlier. He's the lawyer Connie hired in the legal (probate) case for Jerry's death.
- First: notice the wording: "Pete -- Please meet my sister Annie." This implies that:
  - Pete has not previously met Annie, but
  - Sam had previously met Pete
- Second: Sam is asking Pete to send Annie a copy of Jerry's will. This implies that: Annie had not yet seen the will, even though:
  - Connie (and Sam) already had seen the will
  - It had been about a year and a half since Jerry's death.
    - i.e. from the date on the email (September 22, 2019).
- Third: Sam and Connie had both seen Jerry's Will, even though Annie hadn't. Neither of them had told Annie about the Will. This implies collusion between Sam and Connie to keep the Will hidden from Annie.
- Fourth: From the images above (the Docket Entries from the Missouri Courts website), Annie was a one of Jerry's legal Heirs. It doesn't seem right that Annie only sees the will for the first time nearly a year and a half after Jerry's death.

September 24, 2019: Meet Annie Altman -- Voyage LA [VLA19a] is published.

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Interviewer: "Annie, let’s start with your story. We’d love to hear how you got started and how the journey has been so far."
Annie Altman: "I’m passionate about mind-body connection, and connection generally. Part of this comes from ways I’ve felt extremely disconnected through several mental health labels and experiences. I’m extra-extroverted, and very curious – when I was little I would introduce myself to strangers with my full name and ask them how their day was going. I love learning, I love learning about people, I love using learning as a tool to help people. I took all of the classes to go to medical school and then noped off of that path, tapering away from academia through work in two different UCSF labs. I accepted that my mental health prefers creativity, and forcing myself into the science field eventually showed itself to be just that: force. I got existential and came to understand that enjoyment of life is meant to be prioritized because no one knows “how to: human” anymore or any less than any other human. There’s no “right” or “wrong” way to be a human. Science isn’t “right” and neither is art. Science and art are connected, and connection seems to be where all the themes of life play out. I began to feel an imperative to “get the word out” about no one ever fully “knowing” what they’re doing as a human being, mostly as a way to self-therapize and remind myself. I need the reminder that it’s okay for me to have no idea what I’m “ultimately” doing, and that I’m primarily a human being. Accepting my love of making things and noticing how clearly art helps me let go of my defenses, I feel that making art is the most effective way for me to communicate. As I was transitioning away from becoming a physician, I slowly began putting videos on YouTube (the first-ever being a comedy song called “A Song for Bo Burnham” inspired by his stand up special I’d just watched) and going to open mic nights for comedy and music. My “official” parting ways with academia was a three-week yoga teacher training on the Big Island of Hawai’i, after which I came back to the East Bay Area to work for an online CSA company called Farm Fresh to You. Five months later I sold my things and moved to Hawai’i, where I chose to live in a car for three months out of my nine months living there. I felt compelled to experience living in a car, and my need to find a way to make this idea (this reminder that had become my focal point instead of medical school) into a succinct art form that felt authentic to me, made the openness of more free time and less living costs incredibly appealing. I began a book version of my idea: no one knows what they’re doing in their human doings and beingness, and that’s really beautiful because it connects us all. It’s like pooping or death. On island I taught yoga, I made more YouTube videos, I ghost-wrote for a YouTuber, I drove for Lyft, I explored outside, I met new people. I wrote more for my book version of the idea than I had ever written on one consecutive thing, journaling my way through all I had learned in life so far and observing for patterns. I reflected a lot alone, especially while living in the car, and I reflected a lot with the people I met who were open to questions about their human experience. My original idea had expanded to say that know one knows how to human, and also that there are themes of being human that all humans encounter, and that talking about these themes helps everyone. I moved to LA last August while transitioning my idea to a movie version about me writing the book version – it was all very Hollywood. I worked as a ghostwriter for a painter and also as a budtender at a dispensary. To support what I was working on creatively, and to help me find much-needed clarity, I began a podcast. I was feeling overwhelmed with non-numerical data and the weight of taking art and life overly seriously. Some part of me also knew that I needed to make a project where it was built-in for me to ask for help. I decided the podcast would be a conversational interview about a human truth, to serve as a reminder that we are all connected through our truths, our joys, and our challenges. I know that open dialogue is super important to me and feel that is where to start with what “goods” I offer. The podcast was originally called “True Shit” (I learned iTunes will not allow even “self-censored” expletives), and that is still the premise of what is now called The Annie Altman Show. Starting the podcast made it clear to me that my overall idea was meant to be verbal. I circled back to my love of stand-up and live performance and knew that the art I was making was intended to be a one-woman show, that has settled on the title “The Hum|Annie.” The Annie Altman Show is what I call the podcast and other creative projects – videos, blogs, food, comedy, and more – that serve as “field mesearch” for the idea that has evolved into The Hum|Annie. The Hum|Annie is an interactive stand up comedy musical philosophy show about how no one ever fully “figures out” how to human, how there’s 10 “C” themes to the human experience, that are connected by and exist within the “C” theme of connection, and how maximizing resource equity minimizing human suffering. These themes in this organization are a tool to check in with our mental, physical, and emotional (which is, to me, synonymous to spiritual) health. That’s what finding and using them has given to me and what I am offering for others to experiment with for them. The Hum|Annie reminds me that I can only be an expert on myself and my humaning, and explores what this can offer to humanity. The Hum|Annie makes fun of things like being my form of brevity, uses my life story to examine common themes in all life stories, and reflects on how self-deprecation differs from honest self-reflection. I believe my role of service is in asking questions and making connections, using tools like play, comedy, and music. I’m an intense proponent of experiential learning and believe doing and sharing my own learning is my most effective tool to offer. Making these projects and this show is me walking the walk of putting my own oxygen mask on first.
Interviewer: "Great, so let’s dig a little deeper into the story – has it been an easy path overall and if not, what were the challenges you’ve had to overcome?"
Annie Altman: "Yes and no, and it’s been a weird and fun combination. I intentionally took a 180 turn within my spiraling circle life path, which is challenging for anyone to do smoothly and I was especially clumsy. The mishaps led to a lot more for me to learn about, such as accepting “mistakes” as a necessary part of any learning process. My relationship with my family as we all grieve has been the most challenging struggle along this process. My dad died from a heart attack on May 2018, on the same day I had a flight booked from Hawaii to St. Louis. We had video chatted the day before and were super close. For me, the grieving process feels like going through all the cycles again and again in slightly different ways in a spiral. The Hum|Annie is dedicated to him. I’m grateful that he was (and is) this project’s biggest cheerleader. The Hum|Annie uses all the knowledge I’ve received from my mental health and grieving journeys so far, which means I must first unpack and sit with how that knowledge impacts me personally. I use the term “mesearch” because all research is biased by the researcher, which, like the placebo effect, is a mostly ignored truth in mainstream Western medical practices. I support scientific and spiritual practices and I am learning to support where I am of the most service to humanity as a whole. I believe there is so much that can benefit humanity through connecting different practices and ideas. Honest reflection, of myself and the world, has been and continues to be a satisfying challenge. For me, sharing parts of it helps my processing.
Interviewer: "We’d love to hear more about your work."
Annie Altman: "I specialize in an interest to help connect science and spirituality through exploring my interests in both of them, using myself and my human connections as experiments. I’m grateful to have found a way, through much exploration, that feels authentic to me right now to do my own mental health work, to redirect grief and shame, and to have the privilege of the space to do that work. My intention in sharing parts of my own process is to help make space for others to have the same baseline of privilege I’ve been fortunate enough to receive. People need access to resources to do their own work. I’ve been lucky enough to interact with a variety of guests on the podcast so far, and I’m grateful for the ways I’ve been impacted by each of the conversations. The style of the show has both deepened and lightened as I learn to first relax with myself. This series aims to make use of my black-and-white thinking patterns to help myself and others notice those tendencies more easily, and to help those with more gray-space thought patterns who are curious to learn more about a different perspective from theirs. I feel strongly that open discourse about being human, connecting all our internal parts, and connecting with other humans and the world around us, are all necessary parts of the process of equitable resource distribution. Prioritization of honesty, open communication, and curiosity about connection are very important to me.
Interviewer: "Is there a characteristic or quality that you feel is essential to success?"
Annie Altman: "I’m grateful for the words of Maya Angelou for this one, “Success is liking yourself, liking what you do, and liking how you do it.” From reflections with friends and with myself, I also believe that success is liking who you do your “what” and “it” with, as well as liking the feeling you experience of connection in your doing and beingness. To me, success is connection. To experience connection, I needed to first accept the disconnection I was experiencing and ignoring on my previous path. Part of my process of learning is also unlearning – unlearning a dislike of myself, of what I was doing, of how I was doing it, of who I was doing it with, and of the feelings I was experiencing that I accepted as “how life is.” I feel it important to embrace disconnection as a part of connection, and remember that there are things to be learned from them both. As action is more accessible for me as a starting point right now, I started with figuring out how to really like what I do. I am only doing what I’m doing because I’ve allowed myself to pursue connection – with myself, with others, and with this rock we’re all floating around on together for a little while. My honesty and curiosity about connection are very important to me. I also believe it’s important to address the financial privilege that I had to graduate from college without debt and to have a Biopsychology degree. That privilege has allowed me the flexibility to give most of my attention to this project for the past two years while working a variety of jobs that allow me to explore different interests."

October 4, 2019 -- Annie publishes The HumAnnie 10 Cs: Change (3) on her YouTube channel.

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2:30 -- "The only constant is change, the only permanence is impermanence...I feel this one very personally, because of my challenges with change, and, letting go of things as they change, having space for things to change."
3:30 -- "In my experience, feelings about change ultimately come down to the change of life and death, and death being this, quote, 'ultimate change' that we haven't {"haven't" may be wrong, it was bit hard to make out what Annie said at that point} experienced before, it's scary, and it's unpredictable, and change brings up time, and 'time as a construct', and seems real, and none of us know what we're doing, and change is a really fun and goofy reminder of the clusterfuck that is our human existence, 'cause the only thing that stays the same is that things keep on changing."

October 4, 2019 -- Annie publishes The HumAnnie 10 Cs: Communication (5) on her YouTube channel.

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3:01 -- "Communication...on a personal sense, it is a mind-body connection -- communication -- through our breath, through any sorts of health - mental, physical, spiritual -- that we are processing. Processing, to me, is semi-synonymous...with communication. I personally care a lot about authenticity and honesty with communication, because, while it's fun and silly that miscommunications are potentially most of comedy, in life -- they're gonna be there, they will arise, and so honestly, I get confused about lack of authenticity and honesty...part of this podcast, all of these projects, of communicating in different forms, are a way for me to do a practice of communication in a way that -- my intention is to encourage communication...with people, to communicate with themselves and with others in direct ways, in new ways, using nonviolent communication, using language from therapy...focusing on 'I' statements and checking in with your consciousness about how you communicate with yourself...I have learned, and continue to learn...{that} how I talk about myself is how I talk about others and talk about the world."

October 4, 2019 -- Annie publishes The HumAnnie 10 Cs: Charge (8) on her YouTube channel.

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2:57 -- "What does a charge really mean? No one's getting a, quote, 'bill of charges', of a-a recorded tally of all of their choices, and the things that changed, and all of the things in their life [pauses] and so we don't -- I-I don't get to know that"
4:03 -- "As I keep saying the word 'charge', it is, it's interesting how connected it is to money and finances, in language, at least in my mind, and on an emotional scale, I put that with things like generational trauma, and epigenetics and charges, reparations"

October 4, 2019 -- Annie publishes The HumAnnie 10 Cs: Curiosity (9) on her YouTube channel.

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2:27 -- "The 9'th 'C' is 'curiosity' - how is a human responding to not knowing? This is one that I feel intensely, because there are several parts of me that freak the fuck out when they do not know something, and so those parts have cultivated and created -- have assisted the creation of -- parts that get really curious, and ask a lot of questions. I also have parts with curiosity about dogma. And in my experience, any dogma is dogma, and it limits curiosity and expansion of consciousness, for the first 'C', and honestly all of the C's. Curiosity...makes me think of self-experimentation, and the curiosity to play, and to explore, and to notice how children interact with the world, and child-like sort of, playful curiosity that, in my experience, as an old 25 year old, navigating how to be grounded in this current consciousness while still bringing curiosity to life, and remembering the 'change' 'C', that there's going to be more to be curious about in life because change is going to keep happening, and remembering the 'compassion' 'C', to bring compassion to my curiosity, that -- I don't get to know everything, I don't get to know the whole story. The more I know, the more I know there is to know. And, I can choose to view that [pauses, small laugh] however I want. And, life feels a lot more fun when I view it in a fun way. And, I get curious about learning, and asking people questions about their experience...and I've definitely watched a lot of YouTube, and read a lot of Wikipedia, and talked to a lot of, Lyft drivers, who consent to talking about their experiences. And, it's, it's fun for me to learn."
5:37 -- "In my personal life, I've noticed that I gravitate towards communities that focus on curiosity, and, that's a fun thing for me to personally get more curious about. And on the bell curve, with curiosity, I check in with, my, my own boundaries, my own preferences, my own experiences, with my ability to be open to the unknown with a curious perspective, and coming in with that choice to be curious."

October 4, 2019 -- Annie publishes The HumAnnie 10 Cs: Courage (10) on her YouTube channel.

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5:34 -- "And also having courage to back off from pain in that place where I'm not breathing [long pause, looking at the floor] uh, which in terms of talking about [pauses] v-vulnerability, is, the difference between sharing a scar and sharing from an open wound -- is language I've-I've heard a few times that I [pauses] I'm encouraging myself to use more of"

October 4, 2019 -- Annie publishes The HumAnnie 10 Cs: Connected by connection on her YouTube channel.

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3:13 -- "Connection, for me, comes back to, we are all connected, all things are connected, in some bigger way than I can see...I [pauses] -- some part of me has, throughout all of my over-attaching to all sorts of things, and, exploring different parts, thus far, of my human experience...faith in connection, and, a feeling of connection to a bigger connection [pauses] for lack of other words"
4:41 -- "Wow, can you imagine a world in which everyone's basic needs are acknowledged as human rights, and are met? And so rather than people putting energy to get their basic needs met, which can often mean hurting people, those people can do whatever it is that they want to do, and who knows what things can come out of people, what things that they can create and get connected to and connect within themselves, when they have the resources to connect as a human."

October 14, 2019 -- Annie publishes Food reminds us no one knows how to human on her YouTube channel.

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"What's up, YouTube! I'm here to talk about how food is a very fun reminder that nobody knows how to be a human ever. There's not a point of being human, in my personal experience and from people I've talked to about their experiences, that's all like, 'Yeah, this moment, I figured it out, perfectly! I know how to be a human, from this moment going forward, I've figured shit out!' -- that doesn't exist. Aaaand, I've really wanted that point [small laugh] to exist, I've really wanted there to be some sort of user manual to being a human, that would tell me things, like food and how to feed myself perfectly for my most physically, mentally, spiritually healthy body, and essentially, in my experience, I used food as a way to control my insecurity about dying, and being a human, and not knowing how to live 'correctly' and 'perfectly' and not being able to control the fact that this shit is all temporary. Aaand, because of knowing how important food is, and noticing how different foods make me feel, and how relevant food seems to me -- which is a synonym for important, Annie -- I made all the food rules that I could ever think of for myself, about, when to eat, and what to eat, and how much to eat, and what combinations to eat, and, blah-blah-blah-blah-blah -- name a food rule -- a lot of people [nodding to herself] have made them...the more people I talk to, the more convinced I am that everyone...has some sort of disordered eating and body dysmorphia, 'cause it's fucking weird to be in a body and put food in a body that keeps this body going...we all need food every day, and so it's not a big deal, it's food. Also, we're literally putting something inside of our body, that then is what our body uses to continue to exist. That's pretty fucking vulnerable! I have a theory also that everything is about food and fucking, biologically...that's how this body got to be here, and is still here"
"And with fucking too, that's another great reminder that nobody knows how to be human"
"Having done the 'really angry vegan' game...what I believe...is that my body has enough to figure out about how it feels with certain foods, and at certain times, and at certain whatever's -- that's plenty for me to be dealing with here to understand. For me to say I have any idea how another body feels when it consumes different foods is mean, that's mean, that's wrong, and that's mean, because I can't feel anything inside another person's body, and they can't feel anything inside mine. And so this whole thing about how do we feel ourselves, and how do we human perfectly, it is an individual journey."
"To ground it in my personal experience with food, I went hardcore into the vegan game, and the raw vegan game, and the fruit-arian game"
"And rather than getting all of this like 'what is the way everyone is supposed to eat' and 'how do we do this', and -- for me, wanting to make food rules, and say, 'Oh I'm gonna be perfectly happy and never die if I eat exactly this way and control this shit super rigidly', which is just a projection of mental health shit. If you've ever done that with food, maybe ask yourself if you're sad or anxious about something, 'cause in my experience that's what's going on."
"I do care about food for health, and mental health, and how that impacts a body -- I find that stuff fascinating."
"So, disordered {eating} stuff, I believe, is gonna come up, like I said, because it's weird to be in a body."
"If you're always thinking about food, restrict-binge cycle, then you're putting all of your mental energy on food. And then that takes so much energy away from literally everything else"
"Because no matter how feed feed ourselves, [voice rising] we're gonna die! It's a sad ending, Annie [laughs]. I've said Annie three times, that's a lot of 3rd person, uh, stuff -- food is vulnerable to talk about, cause people -- they're like, 'Oh, you're telling people' -- agh, who knows. Let's talk about food more - food, eating, pooping, digestion. We-we all have intestines. Why do we act like there's any other thing going on here? I don't understand it. Just like I don't understand how to be a human! Thanks for tuning in."

As noted at the beginning of this post, this post is the 5th post in a series of 11 posts that are meant to be read in order.

Now that you've read this post, you should read the 6th post ("Part 6") next:

Sam Altman's sister claims Sam sexually abused her -- Part 6: Timeline, continued continued

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LESSWRONG
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Sam Altman's sister claims Sam sexually abused her -- Part 5: Timeline, continued

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Previous posts (which you should read first)

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